2007 mailing list messages

2007 Archived Messages

Click on the week you require.
To return to the main Archive index, click the button at the bottom of the page.
Links to all the Photos and other images accompanying the list messages can be found on the Images page.

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] grand tidy up in the greenhouse − visitorsexpected soon
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

What a very sensible philosophy!
(I wonder if the shoe-lace wet-n-dry wick still works?)
John

> I would never think about, to " Spring Clean " the greenhouse for
> any visitors.

From: Sue Brinsko
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: my reward
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I have managed not to discourage the Dtps I bought in bud! Here are 2
pics of my reward...its first 2 flowers. The color on the pics is
pretty accurate (maybe a tiny bit lighter than real) , but the white
outline on the flowers makes the shape look less regular and less
round than it is .... kind of an optical illusion, if you don't make a
point of noticing. When I bought it, it had 5 buds. Now the 2 largest
have opened and there are still 5 more unopened. I am "chuffed" !
VBG Sue B

From: Roy Lee
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Suitable containers for growing orchids.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

They make sure they keep their English heritage a secret as best as
possible ( oops! ) Smash any other cricket team they face. AND have a back
yard with a glasshouse full of orchids.

BTW, those alternative pots for orchids are our 'Shot Glasses', wait till
you see our fair dinkum beer glasses.

From: Max Redman
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Glovebox.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

+Hi John,
What type of spamfighter do you use?
With the one I use there is the provision to decide what you want to go into
the spam box and what you want to see. Its just a case of checking the
correct box if a message has gone into the wrong box.
Max.

> Hi Max,
> Perhaps not entirely irrelevant to your message but, notwithstanding the
> reference to Spamfighter, your emails go straight into my spam folder
> where I discovered this one when tidying up!
> − I wonder why?
> John

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Paph curiosity
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

The onslaught of un-named and `disposible' plants is increasing over here, too. The advent of orchid sales at Walmart and other large chains is I think largely to blame. On one hand this trend is good in that cheaper plants [price and quality] are available for people than might not have previously indulged in orchids.

Don't forget that any person who buys an orchid at these chain-stores might become
a serious orchid collector. Once the bug bites...................

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Vanda tricolor var. suavis
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Hi Nancy,
Yes very fragrant with a rich full perfume.
Regards
Peter from Bloubergstrand

> Hello Peter -
> A very excellent blooming! Can you tell me if these
> flowers are scented?

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Vanda tricolor var. suavis
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

The difference between intermediate and hot is not so much in the minimum night
temperature, but rather in the high temperature. My minimum nights are 6 to 10
against 12 to 14 deg. C. The high temps. are 25 to 30 against 35 to 38 deg.C.
I think the high temps. are not suitable for V. tricolor, because they come from
medium to high altitudes in Indonesia, east Java and Bali at 700 to 1700 m ,
so they are happier with lower temps.
What do you call short live? Mine are open for 2 weeks and still look good.

>...What do you mean by intermediat and hot Peter ? ( in terms of minimum night temperatures) ?

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Angraecum sesquipedale
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

The comet orchid of Madagascar of Charles Darwin fame.
It is quite large, 19.5 cm across. The spur measures 29 cm.

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Is there anyone out there?
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

In response to Geff's comment of "It seems that only myself and Roger are
left alive in this group" well I Can assure you that there is me out here
and I am new to the forum so it has taken me a while to get my head round
the way things work. So Hi to all orchid lovers.

I have been trying to immerse myself into the orchid world, and can't find
any societies in Sunny Southampton, and I noticed one other member was from
the same area and thought there might be one here, if there is could some
one let me have the contact details. Other wise I will have to travel to
Bournemouth or Basingstoke which I don't mind.

As for my fledgling collection it remarkable on in three months has reached
double figures and there does not seem to be any end in sight (yippee!) I
suppose my most exotic orchid is an archnis flosaeris and a zygo. Lusendorf
(apologies on spelling of name) the rest are either moth or slipper.

My other curious though is are there any Zygopetalum growers out there as
since I started collecting, I fell in love with these beauties and I can not
believe there are so hard to come by, easy to grow, wonderfully scented but
very few shops are selling them. So are you out there Zygopetalum lovers?

You speak very highly of the pot that your sister made for you. Yes, it sounds very like many that were in use in this country years ago. And why the hell did they not continue to be used ?????????? For sure they are being used even today in many other countries around the world.

I would not look for a pottery that might just make them for you, as I did some years ago, as they asked a stupid price for them.

Better still, buy a couple to experiment with from your local Garden Centre. They are 'softer' than some of the old ones of many years ago and you can drill holes in them much easier.

Also, Ratcliffe Orchids did sell clay pots with good slots in them. Don't know if they have any new stock in.

And then, bearing in mind what 'Pete from Bloubergstrand' said, be careful with the modern type clay balls etc. So why use something that has been manufactured. Why not just use something like the rock chippings that I use. No washing, no messing about, just use them, and then they will outlast you and me.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Semi Hydroonics.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Could not resist asking you if you have your 'Spellchecker' enabled, as Semi HYDROONICS' sounds like an alchholics type group.

Now then Peter, why bother with all that washing and rinsing and not just try at least one orchid in my culture.

And we both now it works, and also, the one time President of the Kenya Orchid Society had all of his collection growing this way.

Donald Wilcock was his name. He even wrote a good article that was published in The Orchid Review. That'll keep you busy trying to research it, ha, ha.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Is there anyone out there?
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Welcome to the group. Your collection may be fledgeling but it sounds as
though you are well and truly hooked!

Societies near Southampton − unfortunatley Test Valley Orchid Society
folded because, as I understand it, not enough members would serve on the
committee (Roger can tell you if that is accurate). There is Wessex Orchid
Society, which meets in Shawford near Winchester on the second Saturday of
the month, and then North Hampshire Orchid Society which meets in East
Oakley near Basingstoke on the third Sunday of the month. Both are
afternoon meetings. I belong to both societies but my loyalties are more
with North Hampshire as I am a member of the committee!

From:
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Is there anyone out there?
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

hello agai Nat try and look on mcbeans site or catalogue im sure they do
zygos dont know about burnhams or ratcliffs

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Suitable containers for growing orchids.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

> Well bred Australians do not drink beer from plastic containers. Wine maybe,
> if we really have to.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Swan Orchid.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

It came from Joseph Wu ( Taiwan nursery) who sell lovely plants at
international shows , sometimes London, but in this case I think the last
BOC at Weston.

I hope the next BOC , next Autumn I think , in Devon, will be well attended
by these foreign nurseries. It's where I buy a lot of plants. Often I
pre-order from their lists , but this relies on the show organisers being
sufficiently 'with it' to put a list of nurseries who will be attending, up
on a web-site or otherwise made available several months before. With some
National CITES authorities wanting six months notice, most organisers are
too late, I fear , and that possibility goes out of the window, and my
desire to attend the show diminishes. But in general orchid show organisers
want Joe Public streaming through the door at £5 a throw, rather than odd
buffs like me − even though I will probably buy more orchids in my visit
than several hundred Joe Public types all put together. But that's
short-sighted ness , why Orchid Societies can't attract nurseries to shows,
why shows are unsuccessful;, why Orchid Societies go to the wall.end of
grumpy old man ranting..

> Where did you buy the plant from and have they got any other nice items that
> are not seen that much.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] grand tidy up in the greenhouse − visitorsexpected soon
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

A policy of perfection, Peter. I admire it, wish I could do it, but alas, I
am human, fallible, feeble...

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Vanda tricolor var. suavis
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Comparing leaves with flowers, those look much larger flowers than the norm.
A cracker − seeing plants like this makes me want to grow Vanda species (
which of course I do ).

I wonder how much is culture and how much genetic ?
( It's like humans isn't it − which is the most important, genes or
environment ...which do you blame when you see a criminal, for example ! )

> A picture of Vanda tricolor var. suavis taken at a club meeting this month
> in Perth. (Not the Scottish one)

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Is there anyone out there?
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I believe there is − or used to be − an OSGB section which met at Brighton
or Worthing, too.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] is there anyone there ?
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I guess we are all too modest to think that any mail talking about "your
growing culture" can be addressed to the individual reading the message -
must be someone else in the group. And of course, it is easier to recognise
if some remnant of the message you are answering is left behind.

But if it's me , then the answers are that I never use tap water ( where I
live it is perfectly OK for growing, but leaves unsightly limescale marks
on leaves ; in other places I have lived it has been good too, although once
I lived in an agricultural area, where the water was so laced with nitrate
and goodness knows what else from run-off from the cabbage fields, that it
was pure poison to orchids). I feed in the summer, but nowadays much less or
not at all, in the winter. I never feed without adjusting the fertiliser
content using an EC meter, and also the pH, so as to keep within the bounds
that I have set − based on my experience and my experiments in the wild -
see Orchid Review Nov-Dec 2007
packet9 actually I never use powders , only liquids) is very important − the
ingredients for all green plants are exactly the same − NPK etc all the way
down to trace elements. I sometimes use magic potions ( Humic Acid,
Nitrozyme etc − but out of hope than belief.

The secret of having good plants is to be ruthless in throwing away the
rubbish ! And of course oloads of tlc for all the rest , all the time.

Confucius say , any fool can grow an orchid to perfection for 1 day , 1
week, 1 month .... it takes a wise man to grow an orchid to perfection for
10 years....

> Yes l am here, and very much interested with your growing culture. Could
> you explain more to me do you use water or some mix to feed your
> orchid's. l have seen some of your picture's of your plant's and l have
> wondered how you grew them so good Beryl Standley

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Is there anyone out there? (welcoming Nat etc)
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I have just sent Tricia, personally, an email about the Orchid Talk Orchid
Societies index and it has subsequently occurred to me that (a) not all OT
members might be aware of its existence and (b) that many of us are probably
members of a local OS..

Although we mostly post on OT in a private (ly insane) way and we aren't
necessarily representative or 'official' voices of our respective Orchid
Societies, it could well be of interest to fellow members to know to which
society each of us belongs. It could also create a better awareness of the
societies to which our non-UK members belong

If Tricia can find no objection to the idea, might I suggest that, at least
occasionally, when we sign off our emails, we could add such info? This
could have the useful spin-off of providing new members (such as Nat) with
contacts for information on societies and also making us aware of e-friends
we might bump into at events where various societies come together. In other
words, it would seem advantageous all round to societies and members of them
and OT (?)

Maybe Tricia will give early warning of any ethical or etiquette
implications of this knee-jerk idea!

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Glovebox.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Hi Max,
You are correct insofar as I have the capability of setting up rules,
identifying words etc that cause mails to be instantly diverted to the
appropriate bin. The trouble is, I guess, that as the rules and words
proliferate, so does the chance of an innocent mail being fielded increase.
Fortunately, I am able to scan what's in the spam box before final and
permanent deletion (that's how I've just discovered your reply!). However,
to trawl through my long list of criterua and identify the ambiguous rule
would take (me) forever!

I guess that, because I check my spam only every few days (rather than
daily) I'll just have to ask that you accept apologies for late responses. I
don't think I actually lose email through my incompetence!

Thanks for making the observation. My suspicion is that "max" as in maximum
or maximise was at one time perceived by me as an excuse to divert an email.
After all, I have no body parts that neeed maximising and I am cynical about
messages purporting to maximise my finances at minimum expense! Good job we
don't have a Minnie in the forum eh?
Thanks
Cheers
John

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Woops!!!
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Regarding 'hydroonics', I've been waiting for someone to write in and ask
if they could "have a 'p' please Bob" − UK residents of a certain vintage
will know the reference!

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Sue's reward.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

It looks to be a very robust plant, so I wish you luck with its future success.....for many years to come.

Can I just make a small suggestion. Have you tried to photograph it without the flash, and also to take it with any of the other 'offers' that a digital camera has.

Or, use the flash, but make up a background of either a piece of black material or a black piece of card.

Some of Rudolph's and Andy's tips have rubbed off on me, so that even I am taking a better photo than before.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Vanda tricolour variety 'suavis'.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I did have it many years ago, and now I will get it again. Maybe not this year as the transporting/mailing of it might hit cold weather. But I will check out our 'Italian Friends'.

Have any of you ever had a good look at the flower on this plant. And OBSERVED how the lip and the two twisted petals remind some people of a large insect flying either towards you , or away from you.

AND, Tony, Max and Roy, [our Oz members] my Sarcochilus x Fitzhart is just showing many flower spikes.

From: Sjean
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Zygopetalums
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

I grow them outside with the Cymbidiums and bring them in when they bloom to enjoy the wonderful fragrance. I have a vigorous hybrid in spike now Zygo B.G. White 'Stonehurst' FCC/RHS. The RHS makes me think it originated in the UK.

If you're ever visiting in the Monterey Bay area of California stop by and I'll share some back bulbs with you to smuggle back to the UK.

From: Ron Bower
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Culture.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Tricia.
Am I the Ron B you refer to? If I am, I am not sure how to reply or what
about and I do not wish to appear to be discourteous.

Geoff's query "Is there any one there" certainly seems to have activated a
few sleepers!

Regarding Orchid Societies, There is the Darlington & District Orchid
Society as well as the Northeast of England Orchid Society, but living as I
do, some 7 miles north of Newcastle visiting such involves journeys of 20
and 40 miles on some of the worst and most congested roads in Britain, and
is now some thing that I will not willingly do. I do however attend their
shows at Raby Castle and Washington in the spring of the year and which are
held on a Sunday.
I wonder why there is no Orchid club in Newcastle, if a tiny place like
Washington can support one I can see no reason why Newcastle could not, and
before some one suggests that I should start one, the reason I do not is
that I am now too old. I have run fishing clubs, Begonia clubs, Photographic
clubs, Tropical fish clubs and in my Teens a Cycle club and I am a honorary
life member Rosecarp, a nationally known and respected society for the
advancement and growing and breeding of Roses, Carnations and Sweetpeas. So
if Newcastle is to have a Orchid club some one else will have to run and
organise it.
Geoff may well be right as to the lack of growers in the North, but
Newcastle is in the North East, some what different, and whilst we have
numerous growers of giant Leeks and Onions, some one, last month won a prize
with a leek weighing in at 22 lbs, Orchid growers are few it seems.Odd for
there are numerous Super Markets, Garden Centres and shops that seem to have
a good trade in them. No doubt discarded when the flower dies.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Orchids in water.
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Is there anything at all added to the water except for fertiliser? No moss or anything else???

Stapelias grew plentifully in my garden in Johannesburg, so, summer rainfall
and warmth, dry cool but frost free winter. Seemed to grow anywhere.
Alex

> Hi James,
> Nice to see your pics and to find someone else interested in both orchids and succulents. As for the stapelia, some certainly would find it interesting if only you could send an attachment of its scent!
> Wish I could succeed repeatedly with my stapelias − what's the trick?

From: Alex Scott
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: ..heating costs
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007

Hmmm... there are two societies in Cheshire, Mansell & hatcher still in
Leeds, you should get out and about a bit more geoff!
Alex

> And you are right Ron that relatively few people in the north grow orchids
> − of course there are a few − Sheffield Soc.for example used to have a lot
> of members. Manchester & North of England was I think UK premier Society ,
> but I haven't heard of them for years, maybe gone to the wall ? And even
> Scotland has a society now. But I would guess it still adds up to a smaller
> percentage of the population than in the South. The causes being obviously ,
> mainly social − ( economic in terms of income) but after that, heating
> costs must be very much higher in say Newcastle on Tyne than in Weston super
> Mare .
>
> It was not just a coincidence that the largest odont nursery used to be in
> Leeds. A place where the sun never shone,( don't throw bricks, it's just a
> slight exaggeration, and I'm in my nuclear shelter already) mist on the
> moors ( ideal humidity) and heating the greenhouse to a mere 8 deg. C. was
> not too expensive, hence local customers got what they wanted.
>
> Geoff

Hello nat − I like the scent of zygos too though some folks dont
particularly. You can get them occasionally at garden centres and i have
even seen them at Lidll's the cash and carry store. If you want to contact
me off line I will send you a copy of the British Orchid Councils 'Golden
Guide' which lists all the british orchid societies (lots up north!),
growing tips, dealers etc.
Regards, Alex

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Is there anyone out there? (welcoming Nat etc)
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

> I have just sent Tricia, personally, an email about the Orchid Talk
> Orchid Societies index and it has subsequently occurred to me that (a)
> not all OT members might be aware of its existence and (b) that many of
> us are probably members of a local OS..

Could I suggest that anyone re-visiting the pages in question use their
browser refresh button, possibly simultaneously holding down the Shift key,
to force the browser to fetch the latest version of the page. Otherwise you
might be seeing an out-of-date page saved on your computer by the browser.

> Although we mostly post on OT in a private (ly insane) way and we aren't
> necessarily representative or 'official' voices of our respective Orchid
> Societies, it could well be of interest to fellow members to know to
> which society each of us belongs. It could also create a better
> awareness of the societies to which our non-UK members belong

> If Tricia can find no objection to the idea, might I suggest that, at
> least occasionally, when we sign off our emails, we could add such info?
> This could have the useful spin-off of providing new members (such as
> Nat) with contacts for information on societies and also making us aware
> of e-friends we might bump into at events where various societies come
> together. In other words, it would seem advantageous all round to
> societies and members of them and OT (?)

> Maybe Tricia will give early warning of any ethical or etiquette
> implications of this knee-jerk idea!

I think that's a great idea. Just remember that messages will eventually be
put on the website so don't include any information (such as home address,
telephone number) that you don't want to go global.

It is said that if you line up all the cars in the world end to end, someone would be stupid enough to try and pass them.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Grumpy old man ranting !!!
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

NO Geoff, certainly not, 'A grumpy old man ranting', more like an orchid buff just spouting off about what we all agree with, and it's only common sense after all. What you wrote is so true.

Often I pre-order from their lists , but this relies on the show organisers being sufficiently "with it" to put a list of nurseries who will be attending, up on a web-site or otherwise made available several months before. With some National CITES authorities wanting six months notice, most organisers are too late, I fear , and that possibility goes out of the window, and my desire to attend the show diminishes.

I wonder what the letters W O C stand for..........I will try to make something of it.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Woops!!!
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Vanda tricolor var. suavis
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

How very interesting − your lows are much lower than I deliberately try to
achieve − in fact in UK, cold/cool/intermediate/hot are alwayts defined in
terms of minimum night winter temperature, never in terms of day temperature
at any season.

I reckon − and you are correcting my ideas ! that I should aim for a maximum
day temperature of 30 − as an absolute high ( of course, I did say aim , not
get ! ) this is based on simple plant physiology , if that's the right word
, or simple thermo-chemistry to coin (?) another one.

The chemical reactions which we call growing are all temperature controlled
; they stop below a minimum, they proceed slowly just above that minimum,
they go fastest at optimum temperature, and slow down above that, before
stopping again at a higher figure. Draw a graph , temperature -v- the first
stage of photsynthesis ( or call it growth) and it's the old bell curve
again. The actual minimums and maximums vary for the species − I always look
at the thermometer in winter in UK and think − oh it's up above 8.8 C − the
damned grass will be growing- if we have much more of this I will have to
cut it again- and so on. I reckon Cattleyas don't do much below 15, and not
much growth at all occurs above 32...

But I run my Vanda etc mixed ( only) orchid house at 17 or so winter night
minimum, 20 day minimum, and ventilate/shade/cool/spray/pray ! to keep it
asa low as I can in the 30s in summer in day time.

V.suavis − 2 weeks is borderline I think. One week is certainly short-lived
for any orchid worth growing − I have no time for plants which have flowers
lasting only one day so sometimes I miss them completely. More than a month
starts to get boring , but is certainly long-lived.

> The difference between intermediate and hot is not so much in the minimum
> night temperature, but rather in the high temperature. My minimum nights
> are 6 to 10 against 12 to 14 deg. C. The high temps. are 25 to 30 against
> 35 to 38 deg.C. I think the high temps. are not suitable for V. tricolor,
> because they come from medium to high altitudes in Indonesia, east Java
> and Bali at 700 to 1700 m, so they are happier with lower temps.

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Hi Folks,
Some time ago I was shown some Victorian fired-clay pots that were used by Bateman of Biddulph Grange and were discovered in a basement (the Bateman of the 19C and Orchids of Mexico and Nicaragua). These pots had a spread circular base of about 25cm diameter supporting a tubular column of about 40 cms height and 10cm diameter and an angled T-piece tubular top of about 25cm long. The tubular parts were perforated with holes about a cm diameter. I imagine that the whole thing, when wet, would have produced a humid environment for any plant clasping it and that the porous clay base probably soaked up water that would have gradually evaporated to create the micro climate for the orchids. These pots were described in Orchid Review of what seems like 18 months ago but is probably over a couple of years (anyone remember?). All my given dimensions are guesstimates from memory.

By modern standards, these were large 'pots' or stands and their scale may have been an essential feature for their good functioning. Of course, another essential feature could well have been an orchid growing facility worthy of a stately home. Have any of us got one (a stately home I mean)?
John

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] is there anyone there ?
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Hi Geoff,
We all thought you were Confucious and that 'Geoff' was just a conveniently
short alias!
Now you've disappointed us.
John

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: ..heating costs
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Have you actually been to M and H ?
Time was, when I went every few months. Of course I lived a couple of
hundred miles nearer than where I now do.
My last visit was 4 or 5 years ago, and I was shocked then − I imagine/ am
told , that it's worse now.

They used to breed orchids ; then they had an infection in their lab, and
instead of getting rid of it ( difficult) or building another ( easy − they
only had a space a few feet square anyway) they did nothing − stopped
breeding.

Then they sold their stud plants. They survive (?) by buying orchids in
Holland and selling them on. I can buy some of the same ones in my street
market here − for half the price they sell them at.

It's an ancient establishment − poorly maintained for at least the last 40
years − but then you see, the unfortunate fact is that no-one ( in UK or USA
at any rate ) ever made any real money out of orchids.If or when they did,
they took it away instead of ploughing it back as investment − ( a familiar
tale about industry in UK ! )
I could tell lots of stories even ones about Hollywood profits being poured
into orchids in USA, and Guinness profits the same way in UK, , but still
losing money, but won't bore you . The Dutch can do it − make profits − by
using science, and lots of hard work an expertise , with sufficient
capitalisation , but then (have to) produce millions of orchids all
identical..... and we don't like that either , or some people don't. There's
no pleasing some people .

> Hmmm... there are two societies in Cheshire, Mansell & hatcher still in
> Leeds, you should get out and about a bit more geoff!

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Zygopetalums
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

B.G.White (Bertie) was the grower to Mr Strauss − a rather well off gent
living in Sussex UK, who had large collections olf orchids ( among other
plants − he is also known for his camellias ). The collection was
commercialized as Stonehurst Orchids.

I am not sure whether Bertie made that cross himself − several people were
trying to improve on the lovely Zygo species variously known as Z,mackayii -
and other names , but it seemed that whenever it was used as a parent, it
was so dominant that all you got was ever improving strains of the original
species. The scent of the species reminds me of hyacinths − I think it's
lovely , and very strong too.

Of course fancier zygos were eventually bred by our ozzie friends, usually
as Zygonarias − then we started to get pink ones, green ones etc. There is
also the yellow one which is I think Promenea x Zygo. . Back crossed on to
things like B.G.White ( similar ones include Z. Alan Greatwood, and others
which I can't just put a name to at the moment ) they started to produce
some intermediate forms. I wonder about Z. Louisendorf for example − that's
one often seen here now − meristemmed in Holland I expect and I assume that
kind of origin.

From:
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Joseph Wu
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Joseph Wu is listed as a vendor at the forthcoming WOC in Miami. I will have to look at his plants since you praise them so highly.
Wirey hugs and love and xxx and licks from Janet, Bobby and Asta

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: ..heating costs − and societies out here
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

The North of England OS is still very much alive and well and shares many
members with Cheshire And North Wales OS. Being solely a CANWOS member (one
of well over 100) I reserve judgement on NOE's 'premier' status (just a
joke NOE) but it is the oldest with a creditable history! Still north of
Watford Gap we have the East Midlands OS (vaguely 'northern' since it can be
quite polar in Nottingham at this time of year! There is also the Central
Wales OS and the Sheffield OS. If you have a good bike there's Harrogate or
in the opposite direction, Worcester. There'll be others I apologise to have
missed and of course there's that tartan geographical appendage with its own
respected socs − and from where, even CANWOS has a member!

I suspect he big problem with all orchid societies (and I believe you have
discovered this way down in the tropical swamps of Britain) is that while
there is no shortage of members, there is a distinct shortage of
members-prepared-to-participate in the running of our societies. This is, of
course, a malaise not confined to O-Socs but photographic, natural history,
bird and so on. I find this very sad because organisations that are
professionally structured (RSPB, WWT, NT, EH etc which attract very many
paying 'passive' members seem (?) not to be dependent on their volunteers
in an organisational decision-making sense. (will someone correct me please
if I'm wrong? **)

Maybe, in our affluent (effluent?) society all the young dynamic potential
committee members are too busy working their socks off to pay off mortgages
and heating bills − or busy changing their pin numbers (!).

From: Tony Watkinson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Suitable containers for growing orchids.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

"Well bred Australians do not drink beer from plastic containers. Wine maybe, if we really have to."

From:
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Is there anyone out there?
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

> I have quite a few Zygopetalums − the only catch is I live in
> California...
>
> I grow them outside with the Cymbidiums and bring them in when they bloom
> to enjoy the wonderful fragrance. I have a vigorous hybrid in spike
> now Zygo B.G. White 'Stonehurst' FCC/RHS. The RHS makes me think it
> originated in the UK.
>
> If you're ever visiting in the Monterey Bay area of California stop by
> and I'll share some back bulbs with you to smuggle back to the UK.
>
> Sjean

Stonehurst was a famouse UK nursery now sadly closed BG white was the one
who run it
tom

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Thanks everyone for lovely welcome. It is quite possible that's its me but I
was unable to fine any pictures of the swan orchid everyone one was raving
about.

I wrote my wish list out (well the first part) yesterday by golly an a4
piece of paper just is not big enough.

Why is all the go orchids are over the pond and require an annoying bit of
paper to come here.

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Culture.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Thanks Ron,
For those notes about OSs that we should be aware of from the books we don't
properly look at. All goes to endorse my point about folks knowing where
we're each from and what orchid connections we have.
For example, I always imagined you to be down south somwhere − probably
confusing you with other Rons. There's a lot of 'em about!
Cheers
John
(Cheshire)

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Paph curiosity
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Hi Peter,
Yes! I agree. And very often the plants, bought cheaply through the commercial auctions, differ from their expensive siblings only in the absence of a full or reliable name. The big danger is that when folks buy them they may submit pictures of them to forums for an ID and a tentative well-meant suggestion can become an apparently authoritative label. It is unlikely that serious hybridisers would be confused but this is why I bang on about the use of cf. Something orother Bloggins . . . . instead of a definitive label. There's no disgrace in not knowing exactly what a plant is but there is a lack of responsibility in pretending it has been 'identified' on valid essential criteria rather than just having been quickly 'recognised'.
Cheers
John
(from Cheshire UK)

> The onslaught of un-named and `disposible' plants is increasing over
> here, too. The advent of orchid sales at Walmart and other large chains
> is I think largely to blame. On one hand this trend is good in that
> cheaper plants [price and quality] are available for people than might
> not have previously indulged in orchids.

From: Andy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Semi Hydroonics
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

I have done some experiments with expanded baked clay balls that are available in UKas a benching material. I have washed them thoroughly in running water and then put them to steep in rainwater. Within hours the water shows a high ionic content as recorded with an ec meter. I kept repeating this, changing the water every day. After 5 or 6 days no further minerals leach from them.

I have assumed that the clay had absorbed minerals which take time to be removed, certainly clay soils hold large amounts of minerals loosely bound to the clay particles. I now use this material for some of my plants − the Vandas and some dendrobiums certainly do fine in it. I may try some others when it is time for potting

> I wasn't sure whether Shale and Leca are the same things.
> I had a very bad experience with Leca last year.

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Everyone has been talking of Semi Hydroonics or hydroponics depending if the
spell checker is working or not. But what orchids are best suited to this
method, I only ask as the nearest specialist is two hours away and
shockingly B&Q stock said clay pellets! So if I can use them for most of my
little beauties then off I go to B&Q.

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] grand tidy up in the greenhouse − visitors expected soon
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

> What a very sensible philosophy!
> (I wonder if the shoe-lace wet-n-dry wick still works?)

From: nancy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Hello -
Several of our orchid society members get together a
couple of times a year and 'carve' our own orchid pots
- even the ones typically available, IMO, do not have
large enough openings.
I found a "contractor pack" of ceramic/tile blades at
the local home center (around a US dollar each); these
are dry-cut, and they do wear out after about 3-4
dozen pots. I use them in my table saw.
This is messy and potentially hazardous, so we set up
the work area outdoors, and all wear long
pants/sleeves, closed-toe shoes (a bit of red-hot
terra cotta in a sandal is inspirational!), goggles,
earplugs, and a respirator.
However, you can carve up the typical terra cotta pot
suitable for orchid culture in 3-4 passes, so we can
do enough for our use in a half hour or so...somebody
you know will have a table saw − offer a few free
pots!
These go like hotcakes at our semi-annual 'swap' too.
Regards − Nancy

~~~~~~~~~~~
"Age does not protect you from love. But
love, to some extent, protects you from age."
---------------Anais Nin

Blame Geoff if you like as it was he that mentioned about the months requirement that some suppliers needed to obtain a permit.

Is there anyone out there in this whole wide world of ours that can help me to get a face to face chat with someone who works for CITES who is intelligent enough to take on board what I have to say.

And furthermore, I would hope that I can persuade CITES to have a rethink about orchids and their laws which govern the FAIR TRADE in these plants.

It was after what Geoff said about the months requirements that I had a thought.

Knowing as we all do, that almost all of the buying of orchids that we do as a collective bunch of hobbyists is done in a most honest way, and that almost all of the plants that we buy are not endangered species, I would propose this change in the law.

It is up to the SELLER to provide CITES with any information, if they so ask for it, to confirm that the plants that the SELLER is offering are not endangered species.

And then, any CITES personnel can then visit the SELLERS premises and maybe come face to face with the fact that the SELLER grows thousands of orchids in a single year which are sold all over the world. None of which of course are endangered species.

Maybe then, and only then will all of the orchid buffs the world over offer their help if asked for by CITES to collectively help save any endangered species. And while a CITES person is visiting a SELLERS nursery, they will not only be staggered by what they see, but realise just how many seeds are in one pod, that if handled by the correct nurseries would, in a matter of a few years render an endangered species as no longer endangered.

Summing up I would say that CITES should drop this ridiculous idea of wanting me to apply for a permit, but should, if they think I have purchased orchids that are on the endangered species list, visit my home and question me. And see where it would get them. They would learn a great deal.

No, I just see them at shows. I heard that the company had sold off a lot
of good stud plants at one time. It does seem hard to make money with
orchids, the Dutch seem to do it. Reminds me of seeing a a recent
'Gardeners World' program with an english chap who was growing cymbidiums
for cut flowers and he said he was financed by a dutch grower!
Regards
Alex Scott

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Oh yes, of course we have a stately home − you have to touch your forelock
when you get near , or it's the stocks for you !.

> Some time ago I was shown some Victorian fired-clay pots that were used by
> Bateman of Biddulph Grange and were discovered in a basement (the Bateman of
> the 19C and Orchids of Mexico and Nicaragua). These pots had a spread
> circular base of about 25cm diameter supporting a tubular column of about 40
> cms height and 10cm diameter and an angled T-piece tubular top of about 25cm
> long. The tubular parts were perforated with holes about a cm diameter. I
> imagine that the whole thing, when wet, would have produced a humid
> environment for any plant clasping it and that the porous clay base
> probably soaked up water that would have gradually evaporated to create the
> micro climate for the orchids. These pots were described in Orchid Review of
> what seems like 18 months ago but is probably over a couple of years (anyone
> remember?). All my given dimensions are guesstimates from memory.
>
> By modern standards, these were large 'pots' or stands and their scale may
> have been an essential feature for their good functioning. Of course,
> another essential feature could well have been an orchid growing facility
> worthy of a stately home. Have any of us got one (a stately home I mean)?

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Grumpy old man ranting !!!
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

> I wonder what the letters W O C stand for..........I will try to make
> something of it.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Paph curiosity
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Have you not noticed my "URG" ? unregistered grex − that's a posh way of
saying "this is what I call it − but don't rely on the name"

> Yes! I agree. And very often the plants, bought cheaply through the
> commercial auctions, differ from their expensive siblings only in the
> absence of a full or reliable name. The big danger is that when folks buy
> them they may submit pictures of them to forums for an ID and a tentative
> well-meant suggestion can become an apparently authoritative label. It is
> unlikely that serious hybridisers would be confused but this is why I bang
> on about the use of cf. Something orother Bloggins . . . . instead of a
> definitive label. There's no disgrace in not knowing exactly what a plant is
> but there is a lack of responsibility in pretending it has been 'identified'
> on valid essential criteria rather than just having been quickly
> 'recognised'.

From: Max Redman
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Orchids in water.
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007

Hi Roger,
The depth of water varies from about three inches down to about one inch (When I forget to keep it full) and also dependent on the weather.
There is nothing else in the water apart from the odd leaf that falls in and as regards fertilizing. Well! that depends on whether any splashes in when I am doing the rest of the plants.
No, the clay balls don't seem to become clogged at all, although, I must admit that the ones in the glasshouse do get some algae and moss growing on them at times.

> Is there anything at all added to the water except for fertiliser? No
> moss or anything else???

Lots out in the orchidhouse at present and it is good to have some brilliant
sunshine both to light them and to get the temperature up − the heaters are
on an alarming amount at the moment.

I have not been growing vandas long so I am pleased to have the Princess
Mikasa with 2 spikes − not as spectacular as Peters V tricolor but a good
doer and very long lasting.

The BLC War Chant Siam Ruby I bought on the off chance − onky because it had
Ruby in the name − thought it migh be a good red. Enormous flowers 18cm (7
in ) across and smells strongly of daffodils -of all things- somehow odd to
have that scent on something so un-yellow or springlike! The colour is
really intense.

This Paph is one of my favourites − it has 2 more flowers to open but I
couldn't wait

From: Sue Brinsko
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Sue's reward.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Rocky, thanks so much for the photo suggestions. I'll try them out
when more of the flowers are open, or when (fingers crossed here) the
other 2 orchids bloom. Sue B

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

I suspect Rocky, that if you were to visit a few far eastern countries, you would have no difficulty in (a) collecting your own wild orchids (as many do) or/and (b) buying CITES listed plants (as many do).

Only on bringing them in to the UK might you be challenged (as a few headline seekers and HM Prison boarders are!) If the system relied entirely on honest sellers, the proverbial coaches and horses would be a far more common sight.
Sadly, honesty diminishes as ease of transactions and profitability increase.

From: jns tropic
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Grumpy old man ranting !!!
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Rocky, WOC could mean Wonderful Orchid Collections, Well Organized Committee (not), We Only Carp (as in complain), West of City (not in Miami Beach, but on the west side of town. I could go on but it just gets worse.
I hope every one knows that there is a second orchid show about 6 miles of the WOC going on at the same time.
Tamiami International Orchid Festival The 2008 Tamiami International Orchid Festival takes place
Friday through Sunday, January 25-27th
at the Fair Expo, 10901 Coral Way, Miami

From: Gordon Walker
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Has there not been an even more suggested tightening up of "regulations" in America suggesting that all hybrids require paperwork? I am sure there was an article by an American nursery owner recently.
Gordon.

First of all I must apologise, as I could not remember what your suggested 'cf' meant. Please tell me.

Secondly, I could not agree more about putting your suggested mark on a label where the owner has no correct name for his or her orchid.

Then, if this idea was used I could put a label on my Cattleya which also Andy has a piece of, and be very pleased to put it on a show bench. Just imagine the label saying Cattleya 'Lipstick Lady' this followed by your suggested 'cf'. Then I fell that many people would put their plants on the show bench knowing that their plant would not be said to be 'Unjudgeable'. And I am sure that some of the labels with the 'cf' would display names that would bring a smile to the observers faces.

Does any of the members grow Papilionanthe teres, and if so can you tell me the best medium to grow it in?
Gordon.

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Semi Hydroonics.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Hi Rocky,
I did not create that word. Roy Lee did it on 2007/11/19.
It was used by others as well.
Regards

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Andy's bloomers.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Three nice orchids that anyone would be pleased to own, but Andy, what the hell have you been up to!!!!!!

The second and third photos are excellent, as we have become to expect such photos from you, but bloody hell mate, what made you choose that horrible creased blue background????

It's all right folks, we have met and are good friends, well, I hope we are still good friends, ha, ha.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Hydroonics.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Now Andy, my old mate, you tell us of washing these clay balls and frequently changing the water, then after FIVE or SIX days of messing about they are ready for use.

To hell with all that, why don't you just shove one of your orchids in a pot and pour the type of stone chippings around the roots that I use. And you won't have to use any more stakes as the medium is heavy enough to support the spike, or spikes.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Fresh air Gordon , fresh air − but rather humid air − sprayed quite
frequently in fact.

Does not seem to like compost , never roots into it ( in my experience) just
produces new roots further up − in the air. ( although I have seen it
growing on fallen coconuts − as I was saying the other day − the roots just
running over the surface.

> Does any of the members grow Papilionanthe teres, and if so can you tell me
> the best medium to grow it in?

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Hello Sir Geoffrey,
(Grovel, grovel!)
I've done so much forelock tugging in my time that I no longer have any forelocks.
Any attempt to grasp non-existent hair up there could be mistaken for an irreverent gesture so I'll simpy climb over your wall and risk the glass shards.

So you don't recall the Orchid Review article either? Someone did a pretty thorough decription of those pots but I can't recall if they were ever referred to, commercially, in Bateman's day or if they were a one-off batch made to his own design.

(Retreats backwards, nearly falling over the gold-plated umbrella stand, doffs cap with a flourish and removes shoes so as not to disturb the neatly raked crunchy gravel)
Cheers
John

Confucius he sing; "there's a hole in my plant pot, my plant pot, my plant pot, theres a hole in . . . . . oh, never mind!

> Oh yes, of course we have a stately home − you have to touch your
> forelock when you get near , or it's the stocks for you !.

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

I have been to Kew Gardens today for the first time and to those that can
get there well worth a visit and especially getting a tour of the reserve
collection is defiantly a must. I have photo's, not sure how to post them
so I will attach one here as a test (if I am wrong sorry), but I do have
quite a lot it people want to see.

In the tour the guide talked about using a new Germany made product sermis
anyone using it heard of it? It sounded really good stuff the clay like
chunks absorb water but don't release it so if the orchid wants some water
it has to suck it out the plant does not get water logged and the roots stay
drier, they found if worked well with cuttings. The other thing said forest
moss it better to use with orchids that Sphagnum moss as it does not dry
waxy and can re-hydrate better then sphagnum. So I have bought a box to test
out with a zygo I have.

Kew are not doing there orchid festival next year, and they are not sure if
it is coming back at present.

I am tied and my brain has gone to muss so I am struggling to string a
sentence together, the shop was disappointing all those beautiful orchids
and then bog standard ten a penny moth orchids on sale in the shop. So on
the way home stopped at a massive garden centre off j3 of m3 long aches. Yes
they did have the same ten a penny moths but (again picture will be taken
and posted it wanted) of some more unusual (for a garden centre that is)
they had dendrobium noble, cambria groeg gemengd, oncidium gemengd,
zygopetalum luisendorf. Some may not think so but for a garden centre they
are unusual and I know some of you may be thinking what was he thinking,
well I could give you some excuses about I was saving them from a fate worse
than death from been over watered at the hand of some over loving new owner.
Well I am not, the excuses I will use is this I don't live next door to a
orchid nursery (nearest one two hours away) so I have to sometimes make do
with what I can get and since the noble was on my wish list and the others
were different to any I had seem before and they would make my collection
look really good (I now have double figures in flower) OK for those that
hundreds that does not seem impressive but we all started somewhere!!

Any way I have rambled on enough, but one thing from Kew I am going to start
doing is mixing in some complementary plants in with my orchids especially
carnivorous species.

-------------------------------------------------------------

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Labels.
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

Hi Rocky,
cf. is simply a latin abbreviation for the equivalent of "compare with". An admission that, "I'm not absolutely certain but this plant looks very much like . . . . . " In other words, a pointer to a possible starting point in an attempt to run something down or an expression of a tentative identification. I must be getting myself a nitpicker's reputation but, really, it is just an indication that your plant hasn't been rigorously identified by yourself or another competent authority or that its origin is uncertain (B&Q, Asda etc).

Sometimes, the genus may be absolutely certain but the species less so, in which case, you can write your label as Aaaaus cf. beeus. To cite a real example, I have a Stanopea which I think is probably Stanhopea wardii but it seems to be outside illustrated variations and the most honest label I could give it would be Stanhopea cf. wardii since I am not experienced enough outside S. wardii, tigrina and oculata to be certain.

I cut my taxonomic teeth on fossils (although I must confess to being rather gummy now!). Very often, specimens are found that aren't even complete but need their presence recording. They may not even be complete enough to reveal the diagnostic features but it is better to provide a tentative (cf.) identification rather than none at all or, worse, a misleadingly 'definite' one !

Many of us grouse about the way names of orchids, or any other organisms, change from time to time. One way of ensuring even more name changes would be for professionals to be cavalier over their identifications. Fortunately, they're usually very careful but sometimes, a wrong name from the distant past can become a well used one and embedded for years in the literature. The poor wotsit who corrects it then faces the wrath of innocent collectors. There are no winners!

Just to put things in perpective; many obscure species might not even be verifiable under judging conditions and in the time available. My guess is that plants are often given the benefit of the doubt. It is simply up tto the grower to be aware of the difference between certainty and probability.

I'm sure you know a Cattleya when you fall over one and so, if only the hybrid name is tentative I'd suggest "Cattleya hybrid cf. Lipstick Lady" (without the quotes of course!). Since I'm not into hybrids, it may be that 'Lipstick Lady' is so distinctive as to be unmistakeable but, to me, the world of hybrids is in another universe!

Oh, never apologise for forgetting! We're all pretty competent at that!
(I don't suppose you can recall when Orchid Review ran the article on Bateman's pots?
I seem to have . . . . er . . . . . . .forgotten!)
John

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007

To put you better in the picture, (it is my wife who is the green fingered one)
We grow Papilionanthe vandarum more or less successfully. That is to say, we have flowered it four or five years but it is less healthy than it was 3 or four years ago.
We also grow P.teres from a cutting of two years and it struggles along and we haven't flowered it . . yet.
We also have the hybrid P.teres X P.hookeriana which is the famous disputed Papilionanthe 'Agnes Joachim' (or should that be Joquim?) which some claim was a cross created by an Armenian immigrant to Singapore while others claim she merely found it. Either way, it is the National Flower of Singapore.

I have this fantasy of having a go at a repeat cross but I haven't succeeded in acquiring a P.hookeriana.

All are grown up a moss pole and I think ours lack the humidity they really need. Our moss poles are not water-holding enough and consist of moss wrapped around a plastic pipe. They also like light. P.vandarum flowers around Feb-March.

To summarise this lot; I (we) share your interest in the genus but would value your experience more than I would advocate our methods. (Although I think moss poles are rule). It may be too obvious to refer you to http://www.orchidspecies.com/indexp-pf.htm but there is useful info there.

My guess is that a basal substrate (other than proximity to a damp surface) is not too important but the plant needs to be supported since it doesn't grip the pole too well.
They like light.

> Does any of the members grow Papilionanthe teres, and if so can you tell
> me the best medium to grow it in?

Are members aware that there are orchids you can import without CITES permits? These are mostly the 'supermarket types' but also include some sort after by hobbyists. Cymbidium hybrids, Dendrobium hybrids (nobile + phalaenopsis types), Phalaenopsis hybrids and even Vanda hybrids can now all be imported without CITES permits!!! There are a set of guidelines that need to be adhered to regards the packing and naming, but allowing the import of these without permits seems to show that the powers to be are listening and trying to accommodate where possible. It would have been much easier for them to simply leave the import requirements as they were and require all imports of orchids to be permitised!

From: Anguel Iordanov
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Semi Hydroonics
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Very interesting. I like the idea a lot and am going to try it. Any ideas
where I can find ready made pots like this and hydroton or something
similar?

> A photo of my attempt at growing a Phrag as a semi hydroponic. The plant had
> one root about an inch long before putting it into this system.
> The pot is a 3inch + ( 80mm) plastic disposable cup from the supermarket
> with 3 holes bored in it 1 inch (25mm) up from the base. The red stuff is
> Hydroton, baked clay balls. The plant sits on the bench withall the other
> plants in the equal size normal pots and the water level is checked every
> day or so, depending on temp. Its fed with all other plants. What you see is
> after about 8 months in situ.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Mine flowers the years I remember to clean the greenhouse glass, and don't
put on too much shading ; especially if a sunny year.

Look at the "leaves" − for those who don't know, they are like little
knitting needles , perfectly adapted so that they won't scorch in full sun.
But conversely , the surface area available for all the little photons to
fall on is very little indeed. Remember also that they have no pseudo-bulbs
or corms/tubers etc ; they are plants which live from hand-to-mouth as one
might say ; they can't build up reserves for the future. They need to be
grown well every day..

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Pots.
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

I was not replying to the piece about ancient clay pots ; as far as I'm
concerned they are museum pieces. If anyone wants to spend their days
grinding up ceramics and breathing in dust ( I'll look up the word for the
horrible disease that it can cause − must end with silicosis I expect)
that's their business.

I don't grow my orchids the way Bateman did , I have this modern new-fangled
stuff called electricity see − it powers even more modern and new-fangled
things called hygrostats, humidifiers, thermostats, etc. etc. So I don't
need to spend my life expanding my biceps puffing damp air onto porous clay
with a real brass syringe and letting it evaporate "naturally" . Of course
the evaporation is natural, I don't deny that ; I just can't see how it is
any more like what happens in the jungle than my electronic gear.

Say after me . relative humidity is relative humidity is relative
humidity.repeat ad infinitum.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Watch out with Seramis − it holds far more water than anything else I can
think of. Great growth for a little while, then soggy dead roots...

> In the tour the guide talked about using a new Germany made product sermis
> anyone using it heard of it?

From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Nathaniel Green wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have been to Kew Gardens today for the first time and to those that can
> get there well worth a visit and especially getting a tour of the reserve
> collection is defiantly a must.

I was quite taken with Kew the first few times I went there, but I find
in recent years it has become more and more like a theme park and less
like a place for the scientific study of plants. It seems they don't
really bother with hanging scientific names on plants all that much any
more, and then they have these stupid exhibitions of contemporary art.
No, not my cup of tea, but maybe you have already guessed by now :-)

I think what really did it for me was when I came there early one
morning and found the entire place filled up with what I at first
thought was plastic rubbish, which shocked and outraged me − it later
turned out that it was glass works by a guy called Patchouli or
something to that effect. Is it simply that I am too old? Maybe it would
be kinder to have me put down.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Paph curiosity
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Yes, I now see that URG and CF could both be used. At least it would point out to a Judge that the plant that he or she is looking at does not have a specific/correct name.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: a couple of pics and a couple of questions...
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

I took a series of shortcuts in making/posting the pics ; don't know if it
will work. If not, someone will tell me ( hopefully ?) − undoubtedly − shoot
me down fellas − gals.

1 and 2 are Cycnodes Taiwan Gold "Orchis" which I have mentioned recently.
Snaps of the (slightly better) of my 2 plants. Bought last year at BOC
Weston ( was it only 12 months ago ? seems longer − that's odd- contrary to
the norm for time at my age ! ) Whatever, I've had it just about 1 year or
only weeks more. The bulbs I have made are 80% or so the height of last
year's. but 125% of the thickness. That is not unusual − way back in the
dawn of time when I looked at the results from a parcel of jungle collected
( legal then) plants from Thames Trading,1 year later, the first year's
bulb was often a different shape to the wild collected plant. Interesting.

My plants have 10 and 12 flowers respectively ; flower size 9cm spread.
Grown − for those interested- in pure (washed) Perlite ( eat your heart
out, you guys collecting spare gravel from the gutter ! ) . Hung in my
greenhouse. Kept quite dry after flowering until the next growth seen , and
in fact until the next root seen. Months and months.

The first flowers have been opening for several days now , but this morning
for the first time, when I went into the greenhouse, there was a lovely ,
distinct and quite different scent/aroma/smell. Filled my 50 sq. meter
greenhouse. Words are difficult here ? I can only call it fruity. A lovely
fruity smell ; ripe Victoria plums came into my mind − no not right ; then
is it the smell of my figs, if and when ( too rarely ! ) I can collect a
double handful of ripe ones , sun-warmed, which fall off the tree when I
hold my hand underneath the fruit and gently shake the tree − nothing like
that , it's only the fruit image which brought that one up . Maybe it's a
fruit compote smell when I get a box of my summer soft fruit out of the
freezer and warm it with sugar to make a fruit fool − no .. Give up.

Now I distinctly recall others having bought the same plants − Joseph Wu
(Taiwan "Orchis" ) were practically giving them away because the attendance
was so poor on the second day of the show − surely someone else has flowered
them − what do you think the smell is ? And I think you need to try fairly
soon after they open − I did not catch it last year although they did flower
for me − but less well.

The third pic − second question − is about a plant probably from the same
source. I copied their paper label to my plastic label , but find it
difficult to think it's right. Any suggestions as to what it should be ?

I have LC Magic of Granada ( no problem there ! ) x BLC Waiane King − or
maybe Wraine King . ?

BTW − as to smells, this has the real, the genuine, the only , Cattleya
perfume.

My idea of heaven would be to be in a warm dark room, with this scent
wafting on the tropic breeze. ( who finished off a bottle of Chablis with
his lunch − guess.)

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Would you believe it !!!
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

So, not bad for £4.99, and just the thing to catch the eye of budding orchid enthusiasts.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Come on now Nat , you are kidding us − that's not a plant in the Reserve
Collection at Kew, it's a Thailand bred Vanda hybrid. I know that plants
seized as illegal get sent to Kew − I've had it happen myself when some
idiot put the wrong date on the CITES permit so that it was out of date when
the plants arrived, but I have been told − assured − that they don't
actually want them , can't be bothered with them, and certainly they have no
place in the Reserve Collection − unless the dreaded hand of
commercialisation has got a greater grip on our beloved RBG Kew than I dare
suppose.

One of our lurker members is a scientist at Kew − come on Tim, tell me it
ain't so ?

I have been told so many times, that for the seized orchids, they have no
staff or space to deal with them. I suspect that they don't want to be
bothered to send them to anyone who can − and this is where CITES is utterly
mad − good orchids destroyed, because they are illegal − ( they say that
they send them to someone who knows how to look after them, but I'm still
waiting for my first delivery of seized illegal paph's and I hold the
National Collection ! ) what they actually do, by the time the mills of
bureaucracy have ground their way , is put the − by then − dead − plants on
the compost heap.

I've seen the Reserve Collections − hundreds, thousands, for all I know
millions of green plants, hanging on plaques, never a flower in sight ( oh,
sorry, I missed that, I didn't bring my microscope with me )and , sorry to
say, but truth to tell , dead boring...

There may be 35 thousand species of orchids, but let's face it. There is or
are ( can't stop to think that one out) only a few hundred species, well
some say a thousand, actually worth growing unless you are not merely
orchid obsessed, but also fanatical to a point well past insanity. The rest
have small, dull, inconspicuous, short lived flowers, sometimes with foul
smells, often carried singly on enormous plants. I know I'm bonkers about
orchids, but a short tour of the Reserve Collection , realising that there
are tens of thousands of orchids which leave me on the edge of hypothermia,
restores my faith in my sanity.

Ps your pic, apart from me having to get out a telescope to look at it ( try
500px sq next time ? ) was fine.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: A bit of a trim
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

I don't like to nag − no, seriously, I don't in spite of all evidence to
the contrary − but could you chaps trim some of the excess from messages
when replying, especially when it's rather long like a Digest, pretty
please?

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

It would have been much easier for them to simply leave the import requirements as they were and require all imports of orchids to be permitised!

Yes, I agree, a PERMIT that would be supplied by the SELLER, and a CITES piece of paper would only be required if the imports were Endangered Species, and again be supplied by the SELLER.

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Pots.
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007

Hi Geoff,
I wasn't advocating a wholesale return to the Beaker period − I was just trying to put on record that our forebears had been around the holy plant pot routine before. Just a historical reference . . if only I could have found it . . . to the grandiose conditions like wot you'll recall (!)
(Y'can't reach me here with your humidifier)
Cheers
(Doff, doff)
John

> I was not replying to the piece about ancient clay pots ; as far as I'm
> concerned they are museum pieces. If anyone wants to spend their days
> grinding up ceramics and breathing in dust ( I'll look up the word for
> the horrible disease that it can cause − must end with silicosis I
> expect) that's their business.

Thanks to all who gave their views on P. teres.
I was growing in moss on the bottom shelf and getting lots of roots coming out every couple of inches but also black dead leaves.
Gordon.

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] A bit of a trim
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

Is that a polite ref to me? Sorry Tricia but folks were implying it was the
hibernating season and they needed wakening up.
John

>I don't like to nag − no, seriously, I don't in spite of all evidence to
> the contrary − but could you chaps trim some of the excess from messages
> when replying, especially when it's rather long like a Digest, pretty
> please?

From: Tony Watkinson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

But each country have their own interpretation of CITES rules. In Australia their argument is that the average customs officer wouldn't have a clue which orchids are species and which hybrids. So even if all the shipment were to be hybrids, they still require a CITES Certificate.

We will be sending the loot off to you this week in two lots as explained before.

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Kew a few thinkgs a forgot to say
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

I was that tied the other night forgot to say that in the greenhouses at Kew
they hang, baskets of Sphagnum moss up as an early warning system to
environmental changes, then I noticed that some seedlings (sorry forgot to
check the name) growing in sand, which got me think as what other mediums
have people found − like sand, slate, broken ceramic pots that orchids grow
well in?

I am sure there may have been another point I wanted to share, but again the
grey cells have all gone blank and if my name was written in the lining of
my cloths I would struggled to remember that at times.

But one last slightly curious thing, what one orchid or more than one was it
that got people hooked on collecting them? Mine was a Ludisia discolour.

Ok one more last thing, I have noticed black spots on some of my leaves, and
reading the books say list brown spot having a spicy odour no spicy odour
here, and black spot having been sunken and watery, apart from black spots
the leaves look health. One book says to cut infected black spot leaves of
another says to use cinnamon powder for brown spot, I have included a photo
(hope it comes through). So the only treatment I am doing at the moment is
isolation, because it I cut the leaves off there will be nothing left of the
plant, so a bit reluctant to go down that path if I don't have to.

O that was it, Kew mentioned that they are not doing their orchid show next
year but there is one in Wilmslow? Any one know this one?

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] A bit of a trim
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

It wasn't aimed specifically at you alone, John, there are plenty of other
guilty parties!

The excess to which I was referring is the old messages left at the bottom
of the new ones − back on my hobby-horse about quoting enough of an
original to make sense of a reply but not over-doing it. I wasn't
suggesting you should cut back on the new stuff; your messages are always
interesting and often raise a smile on a dull morning. I'm still chuckling
at the thought of contortionists being the only ones able to get into your
greenhouse :-)

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] A bit of a trim
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

Tricia, I wasn't exaggerating! The only spare space we have is where we
walk and there are hanging plants, floor standing ones and those that
stick out from the benches. Keeps us fit(ter than we otherwise might be!)

Last year I was given a good division of Maclellanara Pagan Lovesong. There are now four spikes on it , the longest is now 110 cms and growing. Question − How long is it liable to grow?
Regards from a warm but very damp Devon. Dennis

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

Hi Gordon,
Papilionanthe teres, P. Miss Joaquim, P. vandarum.
I'm growing those three.
Papilionanthe teres grows best mounted on a pole, with feet (roots) on the
ground. If they like the ground, they will grow in, not necessary.
I don't know when it will flower, mine started flowering when it was about
1.5 mtr. tall. It likes very bright light − full sun.
My plant was so tall, I had to remove it from it's original mount, shorten
it and mount it on a Bamboo − Pole. It is now against the polycarbon wall
in full sun and should be in flower, as usual about Xmas. The bottom piece
produced a keiki, which I potted in sphagnum moss with gravel on top and
the roots are now in the mix and it is always wet.

P. Miss Joaquim, I got from a neighbour whose mother bought it in flask
in Singapore in the Botanical Garden. I unflasked it ( 2 plants) and managed
to grow it to its present height of 93 cms. It took about 8 years to get it
to this size. The first 3-4 years were the most difficult, once it was
beyond that stage, there was no holding back, but it has not flowered yet.
It has a suspicious looking bump, maybe it is the beginning of a flower
spike, should know in a week or two.

P. vandarum, a cold growing species I never had a problem with. I mounted it
on a cork-oak branch which I put in a 25 cm pot and anchored it in the pot
with large rocks and chunks of bark. The roots went everywhere, around the
rocks and the bark, in and out of the pot. It was also so tall that I had to
take it out of the pot and off the mount. It is still off. I'll mount it as
well on a Bamboo-Pole and cut it back to about half size. It flowers several
times in the year. It just finished flowering.

> Does any of the members grow Papilionanthe teres, and if so can you tell
> me the best medium to grow it in?

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

> But each country have their own interpretation of CITES rules. In
> Australia their argument is that the average customs officer wouldn't
> have a clue which orchids are species and which hybrids. So even if all
> the shipment were to be hybrids, they still require a CITES Certificate.

It would appear that most countries have similar thoughts. As to the remark about an official not knowing what were species or what were hybrids, if a so called 'Orchid Expert' was asked to look at shall we say a dozen plants that were not in flower, how the hell would they know either???

That leaves the whole CITES system up in the air, and, as I have often said, and will keep saying, there is no need for CITES to try and save any endangered species by taking money from us orchid hobbyists when we try to buy plants that WE ALL KNOW ARE NOT ENDANGERED SPECIES.

Better they educate, no wrong word, ENCOURAGE Countries where such endangered species exist to do a propagation of the plants using modern well proven systems. Then the endangered species would soon be no longer on their list.

I just loved your comment. I've had it happen myself when some idiot put the wrong date on the CITES permit.

Thanks for that Geoff as it adds more fuel to the fire. Sod the fact that the plants may or may not have been endangered species..........the date was wrong..........smack my hand.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Sending a photograph to the Club.
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

I will assume that you are using either Microsoft Windows Vista, or Windows XP which many of us prefer, but it does not matter which.

When you want to send it, highlight the photo and then look at the left hand side of the screen, and there you will see the words:
E-mail this file. Left click on it. Up pops a box telling you that it can resize [compress] the file etc. etc. etc. So just agree with it and hit OK. Then, and it may take a few seconds, up pops Outlook Express for you to continue writing your E-mail.

From: Alex
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Kew a few thinkgs a forgot to say
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

Hello nat − Wilmslow is in Cheshire quite close to me but I have never heard
of an orchid show there. BOGA have an annual orchid show at Tatton in early
june though.
Regards
Alex Scott

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

First, I must cut a piece from a good root and observe it under my home microscope. Why may you ask do I want to do this??? The answer is, that Zygos are supposed to mainly terrestrial, so I want to see if their root system is similar to a Paph or not. And if not is it the same as most Epiphytes. Then and only then will I start to try and formulate the best medium for them.

As for the spotting of the leaves..........I am sure that many people have experienced these annoying marks, and why does the portion of the leaf, the husk as I call it, [piece left after the leaf has fallen] nearly always go black???

I seriously think that a few comments from our worldwide audience is asked for here.

From: Tony Watkinson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007

I must admit that I had thought that I was looking at an email from Peter to me and replied thinking it was going to Peter only.

The "loot" reference was to the money that I am sending to Peter as payment for the Vietnam Orchid Tour that he is taking 26 of us orchid lovers on in February next year.

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] a couple of pics and a couple of questions...
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Hi Geoff,
Somehow the colour of these pics doesn't look right. It appears
as if you used tungsten light with a daylight film, but it can't
be, as you are using a digital camera. Where does the yellow glow
come from?
Peter from Bloubergstrand

> I took a series of shortcuts in making/posting the pics ; don't know if
> it will work. If not, someone will tell me ( hopefully ?) − undoubtedly -
> shoot me down fellas − gals.

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Would you believe it !!!
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Hi Rocky,
They put the transparent pot into a non-transparent pot to
stop algae build-up which you get with sphagnum moss.
Peter from Bloubergstrand

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Digest 2007
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Well the postman brought me a little delight yesterday, in the form of a
letter about Ratcliffe's open week. So I thought I would pass this little
piece if information on to everyone else, December 15 − 21 inclusive 11 to
3pm.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

> Zygos are supposed to mainly terrestrial, so I want to see if their root
> system is similar to .

I have heard ( lecture , somewhere, sometime, by a guy who was studying
them, sorry guy , it's a long time ago and I can't remember names − or was
it Dick Warren ? ). that they grow semi-terrestrially like some species of
cymbidiums − with their roots running through deep litter. I distinctly
remember that he traced roots for more than 3 metres from the plant, and I
also recall that he found live roots on bulbs 4 seasons old. The last point
is quite remarkable- in my view , the quality of culture makes a difference
to how long roots − and therefore leaves too , live . If its poor, then
there is only this years bulb with any leaves − they have fallen off last
years bulb , and should you repot you will find the roots are dead too on
that bulb , in fact the bulb is pretty useless . With reasonable culture
many plants will keep their leaves on bulbs 2 or 3 years old, and they will
have live roots. If there are live roots and green leaves, those 3 year old
bulbs are contributing to the vigour of the plant . But 4 years is quite
remarkable and I don't manage it on many of my plants.

As for the spotting of the leaves..........I am sure that many people have
experienced these annoying marks, and why does the portion of the leaf, the
husk as I call it, [piece left after the leaf has fallen] nearly always go
black???

I am sure that the black spots are due to bacteria − if they are not merely
sooty moulds starting to develop. However it is pretty well impossible to
have a plant house without also having all the plant bacteria floating in
the air and waiting to pounce on a wide-open stomata − if you knew what was
in the air you would want to wear a face mask ! (joke)

I can't say I have noticed the stub of leaf etc turning black . Brown, yes -
but that's merely a drying up process I think. The leaf junction , where it
breaks off is presumably subject to corkification − which creates rows of
cells which are more easily separated one from another , so that the leaf
can fall without risking damage to the plant ( it's what happens to our
deciduous trees in the autumn ), and I assume that after leaf fall , the
corkification works back down the bract to the bulb for the same reason.

From: Gordon Walker
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Hi Peter, Thanks for the very descriptive summary of the P. teres etc. I
was interested in what you said about the roots on the ground.I presume you
mean within the greenhouse. I noticed something white on the bottom of your
wooden baskets can you explain please. As I probably told you I am
interested in growing from seed and wondered if you did likewise. If so are
you interested in swapping seed in the future provided you grow your own
pods. I am mainly interested in species. Let me hear from you when you have
time. Over here things are very quiet on the flowering side so I will have
to wait until after winter has passed to start again. In the meantime if
you have any spare seed I can buy from you I am interested. Regards and
best wishes for a very Merry Xmas and a prosperous New Year. Gordon.

> Hi Gordon, Papilionanthe teres, P. Miss Joaquim, P. vandarum. I'm
> growing those three.

From: Ron Bower
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

I don't ask, but I wonder why you do what you say, I have 4 Zygos, 2 in bark, 1 in Pebbles and 1 in Perlite and grit, They all grow well in the cool part of the green house and flower well. One is in flower now. They all get black spots or marks on the leaf.

Geoff wrote − "Come on now Nat, you are kidding us − that's not a plant in
the Reserve Collection at Kew, it's a Thailand bred Vanda hybrid." Correct
it was a hybrid and it was in the main display in the Princes of Charles
conservatory. There were few orchids in flower of their 3000 or so reserve
collection the one or two that were in flower Asacerda "fools gold" (photo
2) and Mesdevallia (photo one). It's worth going back in spring when more of
the reserve collection will be in flower. But I can see how for some of you
Kew has lost its' edge as Henry Moore sculptures were there as interesting
as they are, the gardens lacked any skill in displaying winter flowering
plants of any kind. The alpine house was mostly in flower and wonderful to
look at, along with the glass houses and conservatories. But the gardens
were no better than mine!! :-) As I have just re-developed mine and it has
only been growing for one a bit seasons I think makes the point.

Geoff thanks for the tip on Seramis, but I am northern bread living down
south so breaking up clay pots stops me from opening my wallet and letting
the moths out! :-) So Northern's are bread well, with strong lungs!!! :-)

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] CITES
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Tony,
Don't apologise! As they say*; "There's a lot of it about." I think the PC-terminology is "cerebrally challenged". "Brain failure" sounds a bit too terminal for comfort.
Start worrying when you aren't aware of the phenomenon!
John
*ps who are those all-knowing 'they'?

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Hi Peter,
The same three I (we) grow. The only subtle difference is that 'full Sun' here in Crewe, UK, is a lttle bit different from full Sun where you are! Only by knowing what time it is could I point vaguely towards where it might be! Maybe this accounts for ours flowering in Februaey-March! (probably out of sheer desperation!)
John

From: Nathaniel Green
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007

Hi Rocky or Ron, would you say that the black spot is contagious to other
orchids?

Just out of sheer curiosity Ron & Rocky, what Zygo's do you have? Any
pictures? :-)

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] a couple of pics and a couple of questions...
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Well-spotted − I am actually using a copying set-up with a pair of tungsten
lamps − but since I shoot in Camera RAW without any white balance setting
that makes no difference ; when the RAW file is opened up I get to adjust
colour temperature if I want, and I use that slider to vary the perceived
colour on a monitor which is calibrated every 2 weeks − shifting until it is
as I see it or remember it, as the case may be. So it should not make any
difference that I start from a tungsten-lit image.

( I do have a small flash umbrella that I intend to bring into use for this,
but the lamps have the benefit of showing me where the light and shadows
will be on the picture − which one only sees with flash, after the event ).

However ; glow ? I just looked at the two pics again , and they still look
OK to me ! I see no particular glow or halo or anything. I did not even use
transmitted light , merely reflected light.

> Somehow the colour of these pics doesn't look right. It appears as if you
> used tungsten light with a daylight film...

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Kew
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

I went into the new RHS glasshouse at Wisley recently − they too had Vanda
hybrids on the trees there.

I don't quarrel with that − it was your statement that this was in the
Reserve Collection ( which of course is not the same thing at all) which got
me going − I just could not see what a Vanda hybrid had got to do with that
collection.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

If the spots are what I would call the normal type that Zygos do show, then no problem to the other plants.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Spots on leaves of Zygopetalums.
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

> I don't ask, but I wonder why you do what you say, I have 4 Zygos, 2 in
> bark, 1 in Pebbles and 1 in Perlite and grit, They all grow well in the
> cool part of the green house and flower well. One is in flower now. They
> all get black spots or marks on the leaf.

Thing is Ron that I am an inquisitive sort of person, and having seen people struggle with Zygos over the years, that I thought I would start from scratch and have a damned good look at them.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Would you believe it !!!
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Thank you for that fantastic answer. You may be wondering what I am getting so excited about. It's your mention of the algae build-up, which I am sure is due to the presence of light. The number of transparent pots that I see that have a 'gungy' compost in them that have such an unsightly algae/mould build up on the wall of then pot.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Roots and medium.
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Your photo of the roots and the medium just goes to show that orchids can and do grow extremely well in that type of medium.

I hope you did not mind my 'addition' to your photo. It sure does show how the tiny root hairs anchor themselves to their, in this case completely permanent foundation. Nothing to ever rot or turn sour.

Have you ever thought of using larger pieces of rock, shall we say about the size of your thumbnail ???

One thing that I try to put over to people who may want to have a go at using this type of medium is that the rock pieces being rough edged have that very nice what I call 'clingability'. And by using aptly siezed pieces of rock chippings they do not roll around.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Second hand books for sale.
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Hi all, especially U.K. and European members, as the cost of sending a book gets dearer the farther it has to go.

I have just opened my E-mail from Burnham Nurseries, and they have listed some second hand books for sale.

About 4 years ago I asked the question concerning spots on Zygo. leaves. I was advised, thro' the list, to ensure a good air movement. This has been 95% effective on th Zygo.s I have. My small collection is Z. Artur Elle 'Stonehurst, Z. intermedia and Propetalum Matina
Regards from a soaking Devon − at least my water butts are full. Dennis

Geoff, It was about 10 years ago that I went to the Orchid collection at Kew. We were shown many orchids in the reserve collection that were infact Cites confiscated plants.
Regards from a still wet Devon. Dennis

Just to stir the pot as I am in a ''I DO NOT BELIEVE IT MOOD'' Cites is run by Bean counters and Jobsworths. They are only interested in maximizing their own job in European/American Australian countries and totally ignore the fact that China imports tons of dendrobium canes, wild collected and grown on, from Laos, Vietnam. Closer to home I understand certain EU countries still use tubers for icecream and medicines.
Rant ends and it is still raining. Dennis

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Fw: EUROPEAN ORCHID SHOWS-FLORÁLIA/BRASIL/2008
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Hello all, Gordon sent this direct to me as he wasn't sure if list members
would be interested. I intend to put something on the website but thought
it might be a good idea to send it anyway.

Krefeld (Krefeld Zoo) − Germany − February 8-10, 2008
Bad Salzuflen − Germany- February 28 to March 2nd, 2008

If you would like to place an order for us to take to these shows, please
read the following instructions:

5-There will be a Shipping & Handling charge of US$1.50 per plant. This
covers documents, freight, and brokerage for your plants.

6- In most cases, payment may be made upon pick up at the show. Larger
orders over US $1,000, may be required to send a deposit, we will advise if
necessary.

8- Our online price list can be found at www.floralia.com.br, and then
click on the orchid icon for English.

9- ORDERS MUST BE RECEIVED 45 days before the show dates, TO INSURE THE
TIME REQUIRED TO APPLY FOR DOCUMENTS IN ALL COUNTRIES.

From: PG Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Query
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007

Hi Gordon
. I noticed something white on the bottom of your wooden baskets can you explain please.

Yes, this is a plastic grid from a fluorescent light diffusor. The baskets
are home m

MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE	MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE
January	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	February	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-28
March	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	April	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
May	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	June	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
July	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	August	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
September	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	October	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
November	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	December	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31

2007 Archived Messages

22—30 November