April 2007 mailing list messages

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From: jns tropic
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] orchid pics / I do it free
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 02:25

Geoff, have you looked at what's in 'MSN Office Live'
? My site is produced using Office Live Basic. MSN
gave me the space and my own domain name. Check out
my site: http://togofcoralgables.com/default.aspx
This site and domain is free but if you want a more
sophisticated site their prices seem reasonable. My
only problem is that I must build the site in Windows.
Normally I use Linux (Suse).
jns

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: orchid pics
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 09:35

Geoffrey Hands wrote:
> Where did you find that Window Tricia ? I used "Find" and could not
> discover it ? Is it one in your ISP's site , or where ?

Oops, sorry − I should have said that the screen shot is the configuration
window in one of my browsers, which won't run under Microsoft Windows
unless an emulator is installed. It was meant as an example. Is there a way
to configure IE not to use a proxy?

From: Tony Watkinson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Chiloschista usenoides
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:25

> These leafless orchids always, I am sorry to have to say , reduce me to
> helpless laughter .It is enough of a challenge to try and grow a
> reasonable
> decent christian orchid

Christian Orchids???? Whatever next!!! I hope the Taliban has not heard of
them!!

The only thing worse in my greenhouse would be one of these
> underground orchids the Australians pretend to have − they live and
> flower
> underground , never appear above ground − so they say.( Pause for more
> laughter ).

Ohhh!!! Ye of little faith (Christian indeed!!) Cop this lot!!
http://members.iinet.net.au/%7Eemntee/Rhizanthella_gardnerii1.htm
And I really have seen one!!! (At the Kings Park Laboratory admittedly, but
it was alive and growing)

> this paragraph has had too many sub-clauses and I have
> lost the thread − what I meant to say was that I finished that bottle of
> very good Chablis on my own − I expect you can tell....
>
> Regards to you all
>
> Geoff

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Chiloschista usenoides
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:35

Hi Geoff,
Comforting to know my habits (of neglect) are on par with those of experts.
Confucious eh? . . . . . A personal friend was he?
He seems to have been a bright lad. I'll bet he taught you all you know
about orchids!
If he was still with us I reckon that Confucious, he'd say,
"ask all-knowledgeableYa-Hoo about orchids and me."
(and perhaps the spelling of knowledgeable)
Best wishes
John

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] orchid pics / I do it free
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:55

Thanks Jordan − very helpful. I have printed that out and I'll explore it
tonight, after another day of toil...

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: orchid pics
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 11:20

Thanks Tricia. I have explored this via Microsoft , and found some info on
this − although when I thought had finished the job, I got the message

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Two nice orchids.
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 11:30

The multi flowered item is: Epicattleya Rene Marques 'Flame Thrower'. And I am really chuffed with the way that this plant has performed.

The other item is the same flower that I hoped some person might be able to put a name to, or at least suggest a way forward..........but as yet I have had no answers.

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Biff. harrisoniae
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 17:15

Francis, I have no idea how to flower it but whatever I do it keeps growing. I have plants in the warm and intermediate temperature. in sun and shade, dry and wet. Not a glimmer of a flower just more bulbs. It really is begining to try my patience
Ron, thanks for mentioning water butts. So far I've not run out with my 6 but when I looked I was just about out so I've joined the farmers rain dance forum.
Regards from a misty and sunless Devon.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Two nice orchids.
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 18:05

Roger Grier wrote:
> The other item is the same flower that I hoped some person might be able
> to put a name to, or at least suggest a way forward..........but as yet I
> have had no answers.

I suspect the problem is that there are so many Cattleyas/hybrids which it
might be. I have a feeling it could have some gaskelliana in it, but I
could be wrong.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Delayed emails
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 18:10

I have had a response from my ISP regarding the delayed emails. They were
very apologetic and explained that it was due to a fault which started in
February and continued until they were able to fix it recently. Mail was
getting stuck on some of the Fallback servers (no, I don't know what they
are!) and is still being delivered, due to the extremely large number
involved...

Please be aware that you could still receive ancient emails for a little
while yet :-)

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Two nice orchids.
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 19:00

Am I missing something ? Three pictures of Epidendrum pseudoepidendrum and
Roger going on about an Epicattleya ?

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Delayed emails
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 19:10

That must explain the message I had from someone calling himself James, Duke
of Monmouth , said he was going to land at Lyme Regis, and called on all
good yeomen to join him and march on Westminster so as to save the Kingdom
from catholics, ( or was it save the kingdom from protestants ?). It was the
Kingdom bit that told me it was a delayed message... Still, it was 1684 so
we mustn't complain about messages being delayed a mere 6 months.
Geoff

From: Tina Stagg
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Sharon's questions re my greenhouse
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 22:55

It's a standard Alton cedar greenhouse − several sizes available, mine is 11'6" x 8'. They also make rectangular freestanding and lean-to. I have a rectangular one in which I grow mostly cattleya types in one section and warm dendrobia and phalaenopses in the other. I do have an old lean-to as well but only have a few pleiones in there. Alton is a British make − not sure if they are available overseas. Where do you live?

1. Where do you live?
Deganwy, north west coast of Wales
2. Is this a seasonal greenhouse only or do you run it all year? If all year, what are your winter lows and summer highs?
I run it all year. Winter low 57F/14C summer high 77F/25C Our outside temperature here goes from just above freezing to about 80F/27C. We do occasionally get a frost − about four or five nights a year.
3. What is on the floor for drainage?
The paving slabs you can see in the photo. I laid them on deep hardcore and did not fill in the gaps.
4. How do you heat/cool it?
I use a 3kW electric fan heater. Fan runs continuously and the heat is controlled by a thermostat. I also have a small fan running by the opening vent just under the eaves to draw air in. I don't need any other cooling but do use a hydrofogger during the daytime, set to RH60, which must cool the air. This greenhouse stays much cooler than either of the others, perhaps due to the octagonal shape and the high roof.
5. Apart from the vent at the top, are there openable windows/other vents?
Two louvre windows at floor level and the window you can see top right just under the eaves.

From: Ron Newstead
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Chiloschista usenoides
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 23:05

From: nancy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Two nice orchids/Epicatt/Rocky
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 04:20

Greetings Rocky -
You may be aware that the taxonomists have been at it
again; now Epidendrum is Prosthechea, so Epicatt is
now....tada! Cattleychea. Is that not inelegant?
Regards − Nancy (now Throatwarbler Mangrove)

From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Biff. harrisoniae 'Alba'
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 07:50

When you say a very hard rest, can you be more
specific? Say, 4 weeks of no water at all? 6 weeks?...

My Bif. harrisoniae(s) are begining to show new roots
and a couple of new growths (I think). But have not
seen flowers on them yet!

From: Esther Koh
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Delayed emails
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 08:50

From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Two nice orchids.
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:30

I admit to not being a great connoiseur (spelling?) of
many orchids, but those two orchids have had me
wondering for a while... I have seen them both in
books and also at Kew Gardens Greenhouse, both of them
labelled and I keep wondering if I am missing some
sort of very obvious difference, but apparently not!
The hybrid is strikingly similar to the species!

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Two nice orchids/Epicatt/Rocky
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 14:00

I think you have jumped the gun Nancy ; as I understood matters, there was
to be a major meeting of taxonomic botanists (etc) at Kew to decide what to
do about registered orchid names, and changed orchid species names .
The Director wrote a most interesting piece about it.
The problem is horrendous − consider that most Laelias are now Sophronitis -
not all , by the way. And an examination will show that if you change all
the LC names to SC names, you end up with lots of cases where there will be
two different SCs under the same grex name but with totally different
parentage ... and so on.
Until the high and mighty reach a decision and new "International Rules of
Orchid Naming" are published and accepted, Epic xyz remains Epic xyz....

Of course if the decision came out while I was in one of my Rip Van Winkle
phases , no doubt I shall be brought up to date.
I watch this space !

> Greetings Rocky -
> You may be aware that the taxonomists have been at it
> again; now Epidendrum is Prosthechea, so Epicatt is
> now....tada! Cattleychea. Is that not inelegant?
> Regards − Nancy (now Throatwarbler Mangrove)

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Biff. harrisoniae 'Alba'
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 14:00

6 weeks is not a hard rest at all ! . I'm talking several months − like 6
months ! Put it on a shelf , look at it every Xmas and Easter, and give it a
light spray very occasionally....
I'm assuming you have humidity under control, of course.
Geoff

> When you say a very hard rest, can you be more
> specific? Say, 4 weeks of no water at all? 6 weeks?...

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Delayed emails
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 14:05

No ,he was no member , just pretended to be one ; if he had been a member I
might have joined up ; as it was ,I went to Lyme , and spent the time having
tea with the French Lieutenant's woman. Much better than getting cut into
pieces by a saber charge at the Battle of Sedgemoor.

(Thinks ; this is getting ridiculous − I'm sober today − I'll go and water
some orchids instead of playing with my PC )

I'd like to be completely honest and start by saying that I don't really have any interest
in/experience of orchids myself (whatever the gardening equivalent of two left feet is, I've got
it) and I'm sending this on behalf of my elderly mother who is as familiar with email as I am
with horticulture.

With that said, can anyone assist me/my mother with the following question? Apparently her
orchids have something called "mealy bugs" and she has read in a book that two substances,
namely diazinon and malathion, can be used to treat this problem. I believe the book is aimed
at a US audience and she's not sure where to purchase these substances in the UK, whether
they have a different name in the UK or indeed whether they are still recommended for this
particular problem (she's an absolute beginner). Could anyone offer any advice? One extra
point I should probably make is that she's not really in the best of health and I'd like to avoid
her handling anything which might potentially cause her harm.

Many thanks in advance for any help and my apologies for sneaking on to the list in this
fashion, I feel a little bit like an intruder!

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Two nice orchids.
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:00

On 15 Apr, in article ,
Geoffrey Hands wrote:
> Am I missing something ? Three pictures of Epidendrum pseudoepidendrum and
> Roger going on about an Epicattleya ?

From: Sharon Williams
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Sharon's questions re my greenhouse
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 18:35

Hi Tina: Thanks for that. I live in Calgary, Alberta, Canada, l hour from Banff National Park and at an elevation of 2000'. I would love to live in a climate like yours! I guess I had better be pretty proud of my accomplishments growing orchids here -for you it must be 'falling off a log' as we say here (syn. very easy). Plus to have all that space! I am green with envy!
Cheers
Sharon

From: Sharon Williams
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Jumellea fragrans
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 18:45

Hello all and happy springtime! Does anyone know anything about the culture
of Jumellea fragrans? I have had one for a year, and have been growing it
warm-intermediate, in moss in a small plastic pot. It has developed growths
without roots all along the stem from where it should have flowered. So I
must be missing something in its culture and would appreciate any help. This
is what I have found:
Jumellea is a genus of perhaps 60-80 species found principally in Madagascar
but also in mainland Africa, Reunion Island, Mauritius and the Comoros
Islands. Possibly the best known in collections is Jumellea sagittata but J.
fragrans (Mauritius) and J. comorensis (Comoros) are also popular because of
their showy fragrant blooms. Jumellea plants exhibit a monopodial habit.
Offsets can form at the base of a plant with age. Some plants grow upright
while others exhibit a vining habit. Many species grow at 1000-2000 m in
elfin or lichen forest where there are high winds or at lower elevations in
moist wet moss forest. Jumellea saggittata produces handsome fans of
strap-like leaves. Flowers, one to a stem, are produced from the leaf axils.
Grow this plant moist but reduce water somewhat after blooming.

If noone has grown this, can anyone tell me what kind of temperatures this
might require, and whether seasonal changes are required, based on where it
grows?
Thanks a bunch
Sharon

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Two nice orchids. This file needs to be viewed with your e-mailer set to html or you won't see the picture.
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 20:15

C Clausiana is an old hybrid made by Armstrong & Brown in 1916 ( hands up
all those who ever went to their nursery near Tunbridge Wells − am I the
last survivor ? ) The parentage of Clausiana is C.loddigesii and C
intermedia − both familiar cattleya species I think and many readers will
be able to imagine the hybrid medium size typical cattleya shape , rather
trumpety-lip, probably pink...

Now I know that in any hybrid seed-pod there may be potential for everything
between plants looking like one parent, or plants looking like the other
that's the theory. In practice, the old statistical bell curve comes in -
99% look like something in the middle, unless you are talking real dominant
genes like some of the Zgos . But then you didn't cross the Zygo with a
toptally different flower , produce offspring identical to the zygo parent,
and expect an award for a new hybrid ! It was not until say the Zygonarias
came along that we saw plants which we could believe were hybrids in that
tribe. But that does not happen in Catts, to my knowledge !

For Jay Pfhals (Orchid Species Encyclopaedia ) pic of the Epi parent , go to
http://www.orchidspecies.com/epipsuedoepidendrum.htm

Here is a pic I have just taken of the one which has been in flower in my
greenhouse for about 3 years non-stop ( explanation later)

Note that the colour of the sepals varies from light green to dark green and
sometimes even takes a bronze-ish hue from sun . The lip tends to pale
yellow in winter , nearer orange ( like Jay's pic) in summer.

Now I have the advantage of most of you out there − I have two monitors ,
and can put up what I'll call Tricia's pic on one, and mine on the other .
There cannot possibly be any doubt at all − not in my mind − that the two
are one and the same thing.

It's been awarded as a hybrid in USA ? So what − they often do not have a
botanist on the judging panel in AOS − unlike the RHS where sometimes it
seems that half of the panel are folk from RBG Kew up to Vincent Square for
a day out .

And by the way this is the third plant of E.pseudoe. I have had, all
extremely similar , and at least one of them jungle collected.

Ps In flower for 3 years. The canes − well shown and absolutely typical , in
the "Rene Marques" Pic , flower at the tip and when the flowers fall , the
flower stalk can and does extend and produce a new set of flowers -
time-after-time-after-time . I guess its like phallys flowering from
branches − the more you can get at one go , the less chance of repeat
flowering. I have seen a spray of over 60 flowers − on a plant at the French
WOC . I have never managed more than about 5 at one go − but over several
years it probably amounts to 30 or 40 on that cane, and its still going.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: orchid pictures ( but you don't need html for this message )
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:00

I have been rather frustrated lately when I made several new pages in my
web-site adding 20 new pictures on each , but having great problems in
uploading them. It is so time-wasting, and my domain host is not very
helpful. I have not been able to find out what I am doing wrong − or they
are doing wrong and for the moment I have given up. There are too many more
interesting things to do.

First there is Eulophiella guinensis − a good example of a plant needing a
hard rest. I put it on a shelf last autumn when the leaves started to go
yellow ( it is totally deciduous in my culture) and got it down a month ago
when I saw some green leaves. I started to water it then. It was not even
sprayed for 5 or 6 months.

This year it has 6 new growths developing − the 8 inch pot is pushed out of
shape by the bulbs − I'll have to repot in the autumn. I have 4 flower
spikes − the first two are almost a metre high and are even branched.

To see the flowers use this html link − , ( just copy and paste into your
browser address line )

These photobucket links enable me to show you pics which should each fill
your screen , without taking a long time to upload and clogging up Tricia's
system.

I think it's the first time I have used this photobucket system here − shall
be interested to have comments.

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Delayed emails
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:40

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: plant wanted
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:45

Does anyone know wher I can get Cymbidium Aldaniti. It is a primary hybrid C iansonii x C devonianum and it is areal cracker. A source ( or a spare bit?) would be great

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: toothy orchid
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:55

From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Two nice orchids/Epicatt/Rocky
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 06:05

I must say, much as I agree with the efforts of taxonomists and other
good folk to sort out the natural relationships between orchids, I think
they should stay out of the hybrid naming, more or less. For one thing,
natural hybrids are relatively rare (which is the very reason that
species arise in the first place), and it should be possible to name
natural hybrids simply as 'Species 1 x Species 2' in scientific literature.

Another good reason is that names of artificial hybrids are mostly of
interest to commercial growers and orchid enthusiasts, and they tend to
have names that are often wildly obscure anyway. Like, if I remember
correctly, Vuylstekeara − I mean what on earth is that? I looked it up
on Wikipedia and it is claimed to be a cross between "Cochlioda Lindl.
1853 × Miltonia Lindl. 1837 × Odontoglossum Kunth 1816"; in other words,
there is nothing intuitive about it, you simply have to know or look it
up. Which is OK − after all, with some 40000 species according to some,
how could it be otherwise? The possible combinations are simply too many
to device a meaningful naming scheme based on the scientific names.

In my esteemed opinion (not that this will matter to the high and
mighty) the only sensible way forward is to decide on a hybrid name and
keep it no matter what happens in the world of taxonomy; write it down
with a note of the date, so when you later look the parentage up you
have at least a chance of figuring out what the parents are called now.

From: Tina Stagg
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Mealy bugs
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 09:40

I would suggest the following course of action, employing only user-friendly
ingredients, to deal with the mealy bugs:

Dip a cotton bud in neat gin. Gently rub off mealy bugs. Dip another cotton
bud in water. Rub over again. Drink rest of gin, adding preferred mixer,
relax and enjoy orchids.

From: Tina Stagg
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Taxonomy
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 10:30

If my understanding is correct, and it probably isn't, once a hybrid grex is registered the whole name sticks for evermore. It would therefore be impossible to have two SCs of the same name, even if some Ls became Ss, as they have, if you see what I mean.

Now scientists are using more and more elaborate investigative techniques to analyse the minutiae of plant structure there is the temptation for taxonomists to recategorise ad infinitum. With even more scientists producing even more techniques things can only get worse. I do wish these brains would find something more useful to do!

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Mealy Bug.
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 11:20

Tell your Mum not to worry about the Mealy Bug at all..........we have all experienced the little devils.

If she feels up to it, tell her to sit down with the plant in front of her and then, with a tooth pick, or a small wooden skewer from her kitchen, or a sharp pointed pencil, pick off the little blighters and squash them. Maybe have a piece of kitchen roll handy.

She has then done 90% of the job. Then, after her good son has been to his local Garden Centre, or B & Q or any other such store and purchased a spray bottle of 'PROVADO Bug Killer' he will then tell her to spray the whole of the plant. Job done.

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Mealy bugs
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:40

Rod, Go to the nearest garden centre and buy an aerosol or spray bottle of Provado 'Ultimate Bug Killer and apply. End of mealy bugs.Regards

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Jumellea fragrans
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:50

Sharon, I grew this a few years ago at 'The Living Rain Forest' in Berkshire, England. It was grown warm, and allowed to dry out between waterings ( water was poured over all the leaves). It was in medium light. I believe the victorian ladies used the dried leaves as Jumellea tea.Regards

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Mealy bugs
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 15:10

Definitely do not use Malathion − if you can even get it. It will kill the
bugs OK , but also kill the growing point of the plant .
Just soap and water and cottonbuds will clean the plant up fine.
Or use meths + water ( equal parts) and a toothbrush − preferably not the
one your mum uses to clean her teeth.
Hydrogen Peroxide 3% − or 6% mixed with water, and a drop of Fairy liquid
, then sprayed through any simple device − like the kitchen cleaner sprays
, when empty and washed out. All of these clean up the plant , are
harmless, and leave no residue.

It has to be said that you have to keep on doing it − some bugs will be in
the compost , and there will always be eggs which are protected against what
you use. So if it's just one or two plants, the best answer really is a trip
to the dust-bin ; wash your hands, then a trip to the garden centre and buy
a replacement.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Jumellea fragrans
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 15:15

I have grown a couple of Jumellea species − they look like Angraecum (
especially A.sesquipedale ) and I have grown them the same way . The reason
they are not better known is that the flowers are much smaller , and- in my
growing − rather fewer in number. In fact they have had single-flowered
stems, although sometimes two or three at a time.
When I say " the same way" I mean in my warmest section , not too bright -
in fact I think A.sesquipedale likes it rather shady − and quite humid.

From: "WOOD, Michael $WG$"
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Jumellea fragrans
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:00

did the same ladies not use "Morning Glory" as a wee "pick me up "
nothing to do with its hallucinogenic properties obviously !

> Sharon, I grew this a few years ago at 'The Living Rain Forest' in
> Berkshire, England. It was grown warm, and allowed to dry out between
> waterings ( water was poured over all the leaves). It was in medium
> light. I believe the victorian ladies used the dried leaves as Jumellea
> tea.Regards

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: orchid pictures ( but you don't need html for this message )
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:35

> I think it's the first time I have used this photobucket system here -
> shall be interested to have comments.

Very nice pics Geoff. I had trouble with the links, though. They worked
better for me in this format:

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t158/Geoffrey-75/Eulophiellaguinensisin2007.jpg

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t158/Geoffrey-75/Eulophiellaguinensisplantin2007.jpg

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: orchid pictures ( but you don't need html for this message )
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 20:20

Tricia' − I just copied the whole code from the Photobucket site − I'll try
and remember to edit them down , next time around.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 20:55

The search on this shows that the only L involved is L.cinnabarina, and the
only S coccinea.

So the easy way (?) is to call both plants SC Adonis. But they are quite
different !!!.

That is the 64 dollar question. Go on calling them by names including the
word Laelia − which is incorrect ? Re-name them ? Who is to pay for this ?
One estimate is that there are 10,000 names so far involved − more perhaps
as DNA work and name changes proceed. And who chooses the new names ? The
original registrants are dead in many cases !

Accept that the Register and taxonomic botanic "purity" are two different
questions, and have all new registrations "correct" and compatible with old
registrations in that we do not get a Proscatt Adonis, etc ?

I'm for the latter , pragmatic answer. But I recall a series of good
objections to it some of which you can imagine for yourself.

And the Register is not pure anyway − I own a plant which is legitimately
called Paph. Mars "Neptune" and Paph Neptune "Mars" − depending on which
side of the pond you stand when you look towards Atlantis.

And don't forget that just because a botanist publishes a proposal to revise
a genus , it ain't necessarily done ! The ones which do get done , pass some
kind of peer approval before they get on a set of Rules which are printed
and published ( well they used to be , nowadays they may be on the internet
- but I am content if the name I use is one which fellow enthusiasts will
recognize- which in fact rules out many of the changes ! )

> If my understanding is correct, and it probably isn't, once a hybrid grex is
> registered the whole name sticks for evermore. It would therefore be
> impossible to have two SCs of the same name, even if some Ls became Ss, as
> they have, if you see what I mean.

From: nancy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 00:15

Well, Geoff, I'm stumped as well!
Not only re-configuring all the current names, but
even the species names are sometimes indecipherable.
I've had a plant for less than 3 years: when I got it,
it was labeled Epidendrum atropurpurea; the vendor
told me to change it to Encyclia cordigera; now, that
rascal is Prosthechea 'something'. But if I call it
that, no one has a clue what plant I'm talking about
(okay, possibly because I mangle the pronunciations).
In the past, I've done pretty well, culturally, with
Laelias − Sophronitis, not so well. Now what? Are all
my ex-Laelias doomed?
Regards − Nancy
(I'm not changing any more tags! None!)

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy (taxa tedium and termination)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 01:10

Not sure what problem, referred to in the lonely middle sentence, "solved" except that I think in most respects hybridising is mainly a human activity. As such, it would be better left out of formal taxonomy although, I guess, there is a need for scientific understanding of the process and registration of hybrids insofar as the consistency of commercial names is concerned. And maybe the recognition of the smart-wotsits that do the crossing in the first place (who we so often revere).

I don't agree with your last paragraph; in very broad outline, DNA-sequencing supports traditional taxonomy. There can only be further refinement and understanding of the significance and origins of taxa by continuing scientific work. It would be arrogance at the highest level if scientists implied that their work was complete, proven and final by terminating it. Nobody is forced into using the latest names except in a scientific publication. In fact it would be quite easy to do as a mutual friend suggested (possibly tongue in cheek) and stick with the names Linnaeus left us with. What a bland and boring world of orchids it would be if we had to put what we now know to be 20~30,000 species in the few sacks Linnaeus gave us! How about referring all orchids to Orchis sp. ? Simple, uncomplicated and booooooooooaaaring. (Tempting to suggest, in the most courteous and friendly way "If ya' can't stand the heat get out the kitchen!")

DNA-sequencing and other micro-biological/chemical techniques offer an insight into the evolution of all life to a degree previously not imagined. Oh to be young enough to have brain cells enough to use for long enough to be able to understand enough! Even so, many of us in this forum have been privileged to have lived through one of the most (if not the most) stimulating periods in the history of science. Do you really want to discard all that?

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Mealy bugs (hic!)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 01:45

Just to endorse Tina's advice and to suggest that other spirits (preferably
non-sugary and often blue coloured) will work too since the spirit dissolves
their waxy 'furry' coat.
It may, of course, be technically illegal to use a spirit for a purpose not
mentioned on the label! H&S 'n' all that (but then it doesn't say on the
bottle that gin is "for human consumption" either!).
Also remember that any mealy bugs treated to such a beverage are most likely
to be under the legal-age for alcohol; I think their life cycle is measured
in weeks rather than years!
To be (more obviously) serious, if the infestation is great (little balls of
cotton wool-like clusters) soap or other wetting agent) and water squirted
from an old trigger bottle will blast off the worst of them (but preferably
not onto adjacent plants!).
The survivors may deserve the happier ending Tina's experience implies.

Oh, and check also any plant supports (especially the clips) and the pots
(especially under the outer 'curled over' rim and their bases in the
vicinity of any drain holes. The blighters not only damage the plants but
also hide away in any convenient inaccessible recess only to re-emerge after
the party's over. (there's more to orchids than vanilla pods!)
Good luck.

> Hello Rod, and welcome to both you and your mother.
>
> I would suggest the following course of action, employing only
> user-friendly ingredients, to deal with the mealy bugs:
>
> Dip a cotton bud in neat gin. Gently rub off mealy bugs. Dip another
> cotton bud in water. Rub over again. Drink rest of gin, adding preferred
> mixer, relax and enjoy orchids.

From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 06:10

"something more useful to do", you say? The thing is − to a researcher
the driving force is not the end result, but the research. This is
something people often misunderstand when they say, like you, that they
shouldn't waste their time on endless fiddling with inconsequential
nonsense, but instead find a real job. The Einsteins and Niels Bohrs of
this world have heard this over and over, and it is to their credit (and
our benefit) that they didn't listen, but just carried on.

It is indeed frustrating when they change the scientific names, but we
can of course just choose to ignore it if we like. "A rose by any other
name is still a rose" as a famous poet once said (Snoop Dogg I think, or
was it Eminem?)

> Now scientists are using more and more elaborate investigative techniques
> to analyse the minutiae of plant structure there is the temptation for
> taxonomists to recategorise ad infinitum. With even more scientists
> producing even more techniques things can only get worse. I do wish these
> brains would find something more useful to do!

From: LEONARD HANDLEY
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: blocked messages
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 10:00

To Geoff and others,
I use BT Broadband with BT Yahoo mail.
I usually view my mail directly on my home page, not via Outlook Express.
This means I have 2 files for incoming messages, one labelled Inbox and one labelled Bulk Messages.
Most messages in the Inbox are non-spam and most in the Bulk are spam; presumably my Server has its own rules for classifying them.
The point of this preamble is to report that recently a number of Geoff's messages have been sent to the Bulk file instead of the Inbox in with a typical day's crop of 50-100 spam messages. I have the facility to empty the Bulk folder without even looking at the sender's name or subject, and often do, so will miss his words of wisdom.
Does anyone else have this phenomenum ?
Len

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 10:55

Lets get it quite straight ; whatever the chairman of your Orchid Society
says, or any other expert ( or "expert").

1. for a plant of an orchid species , the name change − when so required in
the "International Rules of Botanical Nomenclature" is positively required
for all "official" purposes − like Orchid Review articles and submissions to
the RHS Orchid Committee . What goes on in your own greenhouse, is up to
you. What goes on in your orchid society may well be up to your chairman.

2. For orchid hybrids , there are NO name changes which have yet been
agreed. So − you have a hybrid of two laelia species ? It's STILL a Laelia
hybrid. No change has yet been sanctioned . Until the experts have decided
what to do , any action may be in the wrong direction − since, as I think I
said, inaction is one of the alternatives on the table ! ( If that is agreed
, your "Laelia Mem Chas. Darwin" will become "Laelia (hort) Mem Chas.Darwin"
I expect.

3. Incidentally, it is well understood that there are many errors and
inconsistencies in the Register of Orchids ( kept, by International
agreement by the RHS − in the same way that for Rhodedendrons, the Register
is kept by a USA body , and so on...)and have been for years. It's perhaps
called the difference between horticulture and botany , and an argument for
inaction is that the system is not perfect now, and still won't be perfect
if name changes are forced , so when you're in a hole − stop digging !

> "something more useful to do", you say? The thing is − to a researcher
> the driving force is not the end result, but the research. This is
> something people often misunderstand when they say, like you, that they
> shouldn't waste their time on endless fiddling with inconsequential
> nonsense, but instead find a real job. The Einsteins and Niels Bohrs of
> this world have heard this over and over, and it is to their credit (and
> our benefit) that they didn't listen, but just carried on.

> It is indeed frustrating when they change the scientific names, but we
> can of course just choose to ignore it if we like. "A rose by any other
> name is still a rose" as a famous poet once said (Snoop Dogg I think, or
> was it Eminem?)

From: Paul Johnson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy and Gin
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 12:55

1) My best gin is stored in the deep freeze for neat shots. Damned
if I will waste it on mealies. Cheap vodka or other sources of
alcohol work just as well on the critters. [Damned, too, on the
exchange rate now. Yesterday, 2$:1£, arrgh! So much for my June
trip across the Big Pond. . .]

2) John is quit right, mealies will ambulate considerably and will
travel and hide away from and off of the plants. Consequently, if
searching for a mealie source population, be sure to look at all the
other potential host plants like parlor palm, banana, Chinese
evergreen, figs, and basically any other green plant within walking
distance (several meters) of your orchids.

3) Mealybugs are one of those classic examples for justifying new
plant isolation for a time.

4) Be not afraid to kill! As yet, the 5th Commandment does not
apply to orchid pests. It can be gratifyingly therapeutic, too.

5) An easy way to track name changes is to not replace tags but add
new ones with updated names, and record each new name change in your
orchid database or notebook. As to legibility of names, that is can
be blamed on the writer of the label − now, the 5th might apply.

From: Gordon Walker
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 18:55

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: New 'Bargain' Cattleyas, and that EpiCattleya of mine.
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 20:15

At my local Garden Centre this afternoon I was casting my eye over the orchids on the 'Past their best' bench, and I spotted two very nice Cattleyas.

One was similar to the type that I purchased a couple of weeks ago but a larger plant, the other one was a smaller type Cattleya with two flowers still on it. Although one was almost over, the other one looked quite good, [see photo] and I immediately thought of a Cattleya Walkeriana type cross. The perfume was exquisite,

I got the pair of them for ten quid, ten pound to those of you who did not understand.

And now ob to my EpiCattleya Rene Marquis 'Flame Thrower'. Geoff thinks I have been had, but then I look at all photos of Epidendrum pseudoepidendrum and the lower part of the lip is always red/scarlet. My orchids lip is yellow.

And when I punch in the name to do a search on the Internet, up comes a photo exactly like mine!!!!!

Does anyone know who created the cross please, as surely they would answer our queries.

From: Gordon Walker
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Urgent warning
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 21:15

There has been a recent surge in email spam containing the threat known as Storm Trojan Worm (Trojan.Peacomm) which is quickly becoming the largest threat of 2007.

When the Trojan Storm executable file is downloaded, the code installs a rootkit that disguises the malicious program. From there, the machine is remotely hijacked by a type of botnet, peer-to-peer network, only to be exploited later to steal personal data or to use the computer to post spam.

From: TONY GARTHWAITE
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 21:50

I put it down to the way Geoff seems to flit from ISP to ISP! (Or have
I got that wrong Geoff?)

I've been with BT as an ISP ever since I started 8-9 years ago. Had a
problem once along with half of Great Britain!

The only reason I dredge the Spam is to check for Geoff's dropped
pearls. ...Double knotting is what the jewellers use on a necklace, but
I don't think that works on the internet!

By the way, Geoff, your plants are surviving and doing well in NE Lincs.
with the exception of the Paph, which, though still alive, is refusing
to flower. I note that re-potting is advised, so when I sort out my
canned SPAM problem...(The real kind! I kid you not!) I'll have a go at
giving it a new home and see how it reacts!

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 08:00

And, in case the question is asked, I have not made any changes to my
methods or system ( none that I have done consciously, or been aware of).

There have been other reports about my mail being treated differently -
maybe its because I do several answers in one session ( sometimes) and the
server thinks I must be a spam machine ?

From:
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Urgent warning
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 08:55

i wouldnt (http://vil.nai.com/vil/newly_discovered_viruses.aspx) worry
type in trojan peacomm

From: John Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 10:25

Geoff,
It is no great problem for me but if it is of any help to you, you may be interested to know that my system occasionally thinks your mails are spam. Life isn't long enough to work out any pattern of which are so treated (it's easier simply to check my spam box) unless you are trying an in-depth survey of the problem!

Incidentally, the message delays seem to have stopped. I've sent stuff to Hong Kong during a short 'phone call and it's arrived before I've finished. Almost the speed of light ! Maybe we should send emails once around the planet before their destination!

From:
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Thanks (from me and my mum)!
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:25

A big thank you to all who replied to my request for assistance with my mother's mealy bugs.
Hmmm, perhaps that should read my mother's orchids' mealy bugs ;-)

I've passed on the info and she's already been at the gin. I'm told she's planning to get a
bottle of Provado later as well (assuming she's still sober enough to find her wallet).

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Epi. Rene Macques
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 14:15

This orchid was registered by W. Murray in 1979 and many clones have been awarded. Regards from a brilliant Devon.

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Meally bug and Scale
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 14:30

Both of these can be killed using various types of alcohol (Methylated spirit is cheaper than Blue Saphire − best for martinis) as alcohol dehydrates the bug and so kills it. But remember that it only kills the adult bug − eggs are not touched. As they hatch they very soon start laying more eggs so you are in for a long battle. Also the bug sucks liquid from the plant which allows residual alcohol to dehydrate the piece of plant under the insect. I do not have the time or patience to search for bugs. Better two sprays a year with the systemic Provado.
The sun still shines on Devon

From: Silvio a Beccara
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Webpage
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 15:25

I'm afraid I accidentally deleted the message with the address of the webpage
with the cost/benefit analysis of different greenhouse glazing materials.
Could you send it again?

From: LEONARD HANDLEY
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Taxonomy
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 15:30

> Lets get it quite straight ; whatever the chairman of your Orchid Society
> says, or any other expert ( or "expert").

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages etc
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 17:35

Ever had that feeling that one has a persecution complex? Why me ?
Why should it be my pearls which are not cast before the ... oops , sorry ,
no swine in this group I'm sure...

Paphs and repotting ? They love it − best way to encourage flowering I
expect , but remember that they are usually very season-specific . If they
want to flower in the winter , repotting now is only likely to increase the
chance next winter , etc.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] New 'Bargain' Cattleyas, and that EpiCattleya of mine.
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 17:40

Not sure about this − have not tried to follow up − the Epi was the seed
parent, which increases the possibility that pollen was put on , but the
plant was selfed by a bee , etc.

Btw it is not only the flower which is a dead ringer , it's the spike habit,
the canes, the leaves, the lot !

From: Ron Newstead
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] blocked messages
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 21:15

I use McAfee which comes with a Spamkiller file. However, this file has to
be taught ro recognise 'friends' from the others.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Webpage
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:50

> I'm afraid I accidentally deleted the message with the address of the
> webpage with the cost/benefit analysis of different greenhouse glazing
> materials. Could you send it again?

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: does anyone grow this orchid...?
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 13:45

I have been growing this plant for many years under the name Twinkle − which
I have now looked up. ( it only took me 15 years − but I have been busy).

It has flowers about the same size as Neofinetia falcata ( which is
obviously a parent ),and is the same sort of plant but a bit bigger ; but
Twinkle supposedly

Now Orange ( the Asco) plus pale cream or white − the usual N. falcata
colour , can't give that blue lip .

Any suggestions as to what it really is ? There re not too many of these
primary neofinetia hybrids about !

From: Silvio a Beccara
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Webpage
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 17:00

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] does anyone grow this orchid...?
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 19:20

Looks somewhat like Neostylis Lou Sneary maybe Sweet Love although there are many and variable colour forms.. The blue I would think comes from Rhynchostylis coelestis.

From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] does anyone grow this orchid...?
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 07:55

Darwinara looks like a pretty good sugestion, but I
wouldn't really know which grex.

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Does anyone ..
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 09:30

Geoff, It looks very similar to my Vf. Blaupunkt ( V. coerluescens x Nf. falcata). Next time it flowers I'll photograph it and post it. Regards

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Does anyone ..
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 19:30

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: This astonishing dendrobium...
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 19:50

I wish I could say I grew it , but in truth I bought it in full flower 4
weeks and 2 days ago , and this pic is taken today:-

There are 4 canes completely covered with flowers, still in peak condition ,
after 4 weeks and 2 days PLUS however long they had been out when I bought
it ( probably days only . but still ! }

Nameless of course. I call it 'Oh my darling ', Oh my darling (Clementine)
, for the colour , or do you call little oranges , tangerines ? Not that
the flowers are little, or the plant . The canes are ½ metre high , and the
flowers about 8cm , normal D. nobile hybrid size.

I canb't recall seeing one this colour, or this well flowered , a good buy I
think ( from the shop at the Eden Project )

All of the canes have just 2 or 3 leaves, so I think I'll try Denis's trick
of cutting some canes off and laying on moss , IF (?) I get a good crop of
keikis I'll share.

MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE	MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE
January	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	February	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-28
March	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	April	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
May	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	June	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
July	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	August	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
September	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	October	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
November	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	December	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31

2007 Archived Messages

15—21 April