March 22-31 2007 mailing list messages

2007 Archived Messages

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From: Laura Peppiatt
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Sarcochilus.
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 10:00

Hi Roger,
This is a very nice concise description. My plant is in a black plastic
pot and grows in bark large chippings. It looks healthy. I will probably
just drop it in another (shallow clay) pot for the moment.
How often do you water it?

From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 17:05

Last week in the Lonodn show, I managed to get 7 new
plants, of which 4 happened to be Pleurothallis. It
seems as though my collection is now growing with an
interest in the small growing lot from the
Pleurothallidinae alliance, having already 7
Pleurothallis, 3 Masdevallias, 2 Restrepias, 1
Dracula, 1 Porroglosum and 1 Dryadella, so it is only
normal that I started to search further information on
them.

There is very little literature in the web, and most
of it seems to be only available through the Icones,
but only when you buy them. Has anyone come accross or
has had access to them? If so, are they worth the
money for a person who is not just growing that type
of orchids?

I don't mind spending the money, if the information
it's going to be useful to me, but there are so many
of them (27 volumes?), and each one of them is very
expensive, so I don't want to buy them unless I am
going to really use them!

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 05:55

In the past I too was a pleuro' fan. I suggest you think of joining the
specialist Society ( forget the precise name − maybe someone can help ?).
Steve Manning is involved − you will probably find him via the BOC web-site
, maybe he's President of the UK Chapter of Pleurothallids International, or
something of that nature. They often exhibit at BOC Congresses , and its
worth a visit to their stand.

You will reach your own conclusions about the Luer books. No doubt he is the
World's expert , but 27 volumes − and not finished yet − and at £40+ each -
and they are very dry botanical stuff − not nice coloured pictures ....

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:00

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: How often do I water it!!!
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 13:35

You must bear in mind that my plant is held in place with stone chippings and they do not soak up water. When water is poured through from the top, the slightly rough surface of the stones does hold some water for a time.

All of my orchids stand in plastic saucers. This is so that when they are rapidly growing I can water from the top and the saucer will hold enough moisture/food to keep the plant happy for maybe a day or two. When the liquid has been used up, then I can give it some more. If I lift the pot and can see just a bead of moisture then I do not water for maybe another day or so.

In the height of the growing season you will be surprised at how much some plants will 'eat'.

Of course, the bulbous type epiphytes will need hardly any during the winter months.

From: Lisa Thoerle
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Luer's Icones Pleurothallidinarum
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 16:40

Patricia asked if Luer's Icones Pleurothallidinarum series is worth the
money. It isn't if you're looking for just cultural information. They
contain very telegraphic descriptions and diagnostic line drawings that
are invaluable when you are trying to identify a plant. The locations
for collections, including altitude, are provided when known, and this
is useful information for the grower, but these volumes are pretty
technical. I love them, and I suspect that if your budding interest in
pleurothallids continues to grow, you will want the entire set, also.

The information you need to grow pleurs successfully is really pretty
limited, with a few exceptions. If you know the altitude and the
temperature range, that will let you know how to make your pleurs
happy. Almost all of them like it cool (with the exception of a couple
of warm growers), most are happy in pots with some medium that retains
moisture, and few want to get dry. Some need more light than others to
flower--you can usually tell this by examining the leaves. Thin-leaved
plants, such as draculas, don't want a lot of light. The leathery
leaved ones, such as what we know call byrsellas, and masdevallias in
the Coccineae subsection, need good light--read, some sun. Watch the
color of the leaves--it will tell you what you want to know as you
experiment with your plants.

The Missouri Botanic Garden has published the first 15 volumes on a CD,
and the price is quite reasonable. I don't know if they plan to publish
the next 15 the same way--I do hope so.

From: nancy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 18:15

Is it just me, or are there only a couple of photos
here?
Most of the photo links don't work.
Regards − Nancy

~~~~~~~~~~~
"My mother had a great deal of trouble with me,
but I think she enjoyed it."
---Mark Twain

From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 19:35

No It is not just you − there seems to be a problem with the site at
present. This US one is fine at http://www.pleurothallids.com/ − lots of
info and photos

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Pleuros
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 20:05

The first and third..........photos are awful, and there is no other way to describe them.

When I think back to taking photos of British Wild Orchids out and about with friends, my goodness the time and effort and patience we used to use. And then when the slides came back we always looked at them with a bin at our side to throw away the rubbish!!!!!

From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 07:50

I had tried the site before asking the group (thanks
all the same Andy and Geoff), but I had exactly the
same problem.

Maybe I should be more specific in the type of info
I'm looking for. The Pleurothallidinae alliance is
huge, and I'm trying to look for info in the different
sections of the genus Pleurothallis, specially what
are the defining characteristics of the different
subgenus, sections and subsections, i.e. What makes P.
cordata belong to the Macrophyllae-Fasciculate
subsection of section Pleurothallis; subgenus
Pleurothallis, whilst P restrepioides belongs within
the subgenus Elongatia; section Elongatae?

From: P G Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 17:15

Look at www.pleurothallids.com. Join the society. They have a small newsletter
with useful information.

From: P G Hieke
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Where to buy and colour change.
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 17:20

This is not my plant. I saw it at the National Show last year.
Amazing. My plant had about 50 inflorescences, a dwarf
compared to this plant.
Kind regards
Peter from Bloubergstrand

> Thanks Geoff,
>
> Still living in a flat, so I shall pat myself on the
> back I guess! Although I got too excited and counted
> 10 flowers too many on that Den. fimbriatum! Only 32
> (snigger, snigger)... Oh! And I forgot to count the
> many flowers on the about 8 inflorescences of my
> Dendrochilum wenzelii! (Now I am showing off!).

From: Tina Stagg
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Big moss
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 17:35

Any views would be welcomed. I have loads of Chilean bought years ago but have recently bought a small quantity of NZ to try it. I must admit that the NZ 'feels' better but as I already have all this Chilean should I use it up or dump it on the compost heap?

Also, my cattleya bowringiana seems to be going into decline, with smaller pbulbs each year. Is it fussy in any particular way? I do grow other species cattleyas without (too many) problems.

From: Mark Macklam
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Big moss
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 19:30

My experience in growing orchids is not that great, but I do have
several plants that grow very well in moss. Phals and Dendrobiums.
Here in Edmonton, local growers [many with decades of experience and
100s/1000s of plants] and visiting speakers all have recommended New
Zealand moss as the best. I recently happened to come across some
moss, pale brown in colour and 'coarser' than N.Z. moss, no origin
given. I considered buying it but decided to stay with what I know
even if it is more expensive.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Moss and Cattleya Bowringiana
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 20:10

You ask about if there is any difference between Chilean and New Zealand moss. Short answer is, I do not know. Long answer is, there must be a good profit in it to send it so far !!!!!

Our local New Forest has some excellent areas for superb sphagnum moss, but of course it must not be taken.

So, your Cattleya Bowringiana, named after Mr. J.C. Bowring of Windsor a keen amateur. I know that I have used a capital letter 'B', but then I do not share the so called correct method, after all it's good manners to use a capital letter at the start of a persons name.

Can you please send any photos of it, and also tell me what type of pot it is in and what compost. Any other information will help.

When your type of Cattleya starts to grow it really does accept lots of water/feed and to give you some idea of the 'local' rainfall for Central America, it goes something like this.

May 7 inches
June 12 inches
July 9 inches
August 11 inches
September 10 inches
October 9 inches

One other point with especially Cattleyas is the often heard remark about the new growth is just over the edge of the pot and the roots are sprawling all over the outside..........and at the end of the season the growth is fantastic. WHY ?

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Icones pleurothallidinae
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 23:10

That kind of info is − it seems − very difficult to find.
I once asked Guido Braeme ( German taxonomic Botanist who at that time
specialized in orchids especially paphs and had written a three volume book
on Paphs ) what was the difference between a paph and a phrag , and got the
answer " that is a very interesting question"... but no more !

> Maybe I should be more specific in the type of info
> I'm looking for. The Pleurothallidinae alliance is
> huge, and I'm trying to look for info in the different
> sections of the genus Pleurothallis, specially what
> are the defining characteristics of the different
> subgenus, sections and subsections, i.e. What makes P.
> cordata belong to the Macrophyllae-Fasciculate
> subsection of section Pleurothallis; subgenus
> Pleurothallis, whilst P restrepioides belongs within
> the subgenus Elongatia; section Elongatae?

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Big moss
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2007 23:15

Thanks for the keikis Tina , safely potted up now. I have saved your
address, but I'll ask you before sending anything , but it will be much
later in the year . So far I have half a dozen growths starting on the
canes, but all are the size of the head of a match , on;y , at present.

Ps, If the dried moss breaks up when you handle it, then junk it. Otherwise
its OK. Of course fresh moss is best , if you can find it.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Late mail delivery !!!
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 09:50

I have just seen my comment/answer about 'Composts' which was sent on: Thu, 8 Mar 2007 09:37:08

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: Late mail delivery !!!
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 10:30

> I have just seen my comment/answer about 'Composts' which was sent on:
> Thu, 8 Mar 2007 09:37:08

The postman's bicycle tyres were OK when he collected your message but he
must have got a flat before reaching you :-)

I wish. I'm good, but not that good! By the way, Alan's the Boss, not me
(but he can't fix the weather either).

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Moss and Cattleya Bowringiana
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 12:20

I have never understood this "can't be taken" in relation to sphagnum moss .
Why not ? It can hardly come in the wild-flowers law can it ? And I believe
it is a renewable resource − just like chopping down trees to feed a power
station , and growing some more in their place. In fact years ago , when I
lived near a good source, I went every few months to the same place, and
collected a bucketful ( moss , not trees) , and I could never see where I
had taken it from by my next visit.

I think don't pick the moss is PC , OTT , and I can't think of any more
acronyms at the moment, so I shall just say bosh.

> You ask about if there is any difference between Chilean and New Zealand
> moss. Short answer is, I do not know. Long answer is, there must be a good
> profit in it to send it so far !!!!!

> Our local New Forest has some excellent areas for superb sphagnum moss, but
> of course it must not be taken.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Late mail delivery !!!
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 12:25

And I thought it was just my computer problems which led me to receive a
whole 20 or 30 e-mails all a month or more old.

If you are thinking of trying Office 2007 .. I cut that one short after the
first day of problems . See − I can learn !

> I have just seen my comment/answer about 'Composts' which was sent on: Thu,
> 8 Mar 2007 09:37:08

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: for Ron Newstead
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 12:45

I want to plan a visit to Bath and can suggest some dates − but its tricky,
as I want to visit family and we have only three week-ends possible before a
new grandchild is due.

From: goldorchid@netzero.net
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: International Pleurothallid Society
Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2007 23:40

Just got back from the Canadian Orchid Conference in Winnipeg, Manitoba,
Canada in conjunction with the Manitoba O. S. annual show. I was a
speaker, judge and learned some good tricks for growing Pleuros in unusual
environments- next time I bring a camera!

The name of the group you are looking for is the Pleurothallid Alliance.
We do have many international members & I am it's erstwhile President &
will be for at least a while longer... the website is
www.pleurothallids.com.

Our newsletter editor is Lynn O'Shaughnessy & has done an excellent job
of building it & the website! (I am computer illiterate & am learning) I
think she has links to her website (Freespirit) & all the info you mght
need to answer questions. I know the"Green Books"/ Icones from Dr. Luer
are on disc now from the Missouri Botanical Gardens (MBOT) & can tell you
I have not completed my full set either way...

I hope this is a help for a start, I would be happy to be of more
assistance. Both Lynn & I are AOS Accredited Judges -among other things&
are slow to respond this time of year due to travel, jobs, etc...

From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Moss and Cattleya Bowringiana
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 07:00

The same can be said about everything else too. One bucket of moss isn't
anything, really. One elephant or tiger out thousands isn't anything.
And so on ad nauseam − but it is a sad fact fact that peat bogs are
disappearing at an ever increasing rate and tigers and elephants were
hunted almost to extinction; one by one.

The problem is that when something turns out to be useful, it will soon
no longer be 'just one bucket'; it becomes an industry, where a company
stripmines a whole area of peatbogs.

And yes, peat is a renewable resource, but so is oil and coal, if you
take the long perspective. The peatbog that industrial exploitation can
consume in a year has taken at least a couple of thousand years to grow.
You can go out in the New Forest or wherever and look at a lush peatbog
and enjoy the beauty of it and you think that is all there is to it, but
you don't see the devastation caused by industrial production in the
developing countries. They need the money, and our luxurious lifestyle
fuels the destruction of their environment − to the detriment of us all.

What makes it so tragic is that we could change this − even without
making life miserable for people − but we choose not to.

Geoffrey Hands wrote:
> I have never understood this "can't be taken" in relation to sphagnum moss .

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Peat
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 08:20

I have not yet seen the original of Jan's message below ( strange how
messages arrive in a different order to that in which they were sent ! ) but
, I doubt if there are 200 million orchid growers out there, all taking one
bucketful of sphagnum moss every six months! And even iof they are, if they
all observe that there is just as much there every time they go − then
that's OK.

I suggest that it is easy to go OTT with the "lets be green, conservation
minded etc. etc." ideas . It is necessary to keep a sense of proportion.

And Tony , I don't know where you've been in the Northern hemisphere , but
its not all industrial wasteland you know !

> I was surprised with Geoff's comments re... One man's ruin the planet is
> another man's feed his starving kids...

> I accept that there is some truth in that, but on a bigger scale, we must
> all take account of just what it is we (and I do mean WE) are doing to the
> long term health of our planet. I am truly blessed by living in the southern
> hemisphere where there is more sea than land and therefore less folks than
> in the northern hemisphere. (and therefore less human pollution.)

> I have recently returned from a couple of weeks in Bangkok and Chiang Mai
> and was further appalled by the increasing air pollution over the northern
> hemisphere. Even during the Chinese new year when much industry closed down
> for a while, there was still that pall of blue haze across the horizon.
> Sometimes close and sometimes further away but ALWAYS there!! This is not
> natural. I know that most of you folk who live in the north think that it
> is, but you are wrong.

> To really see what our planet is going through, you should travel to the
> south more often. Sure, our cities in the south do pollute just like those
> in the north, but there are so many fewer cities here that the air pollution
> has a chance to fall out of the atmosphere. Not so in the north
> You poor suckers have no idea what a clear day really is. My deepest
> sympathies.

> But it's not until you grasp the difference between the hemispheres that you
> can realise the depth of the problem and the enormous job ahead for all of
> us to turn the problem around.

> > This is true. The problem is that this is also what everybody else says
> > − and it is true in each individual case. However, the combined effect
> > is what causes the peat bogs to disappear. I myself find it hard to
> > fathom just how many people there are in the world; and it is difficult
> > to imagine that my small contribution is important in any way, but one
> > has to remember that what you and I do is repeated by perhaps 200
> > million people worldwide and that, say, 200 million small bags is a lot.

From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Peat
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 09:15

On 26 Mar, in article ,
Geoffrey Hands wrote:
> I have not yet seen the original of Jan's message below ( strange how
> messages arrive in a different order to that in which they were sent ! )

I think your ISP is having problems, Geoff. I have just had list messages
dated ***14 February*** returned from them as undelivered. You and the
other virgin.net subscribers have probably missed quite a few.

From: Tony Watkinson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Peat
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 10:55

To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Icones pleurothallids
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 17:50

As I am a volunteer at the Natural History Museum in
London, I can make use of any of the books in their
various libraries, as long as I don't take them out of
the Museum. They happen to have all 27 available
volumes so far, and I am allowed to photocopy anything
to take home... So my plan is to photocopy the first
few chapters of the first volume and read them on my
own time at home... Then I can make up my mind as to
whether I want to cough up the money for the CD!

From: Dennis Read
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Lycaste Kiama
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 19:25

I have just found a division of Lycaste Kiama. This is a hybrid made by Fred Alcorn − a wellrespected Australian hybridizer. The descriptions on Google vary considerably. Can any of our Australin contacts advise what I may expect. Regards from sunny but still cold Devon.

Help i have Dendrobium kingianum var silcocks but cannot find info on it,
its in bloom very perfumed and pure white,can anyone help?

From: Laura Peppiatt
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] How often do I water it!!!
Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 09:20

Thank you for your advise. This is amazing how differently the same
plants can be grown with a good result.

From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Tony's Dendrobe.
Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 18:10

The item that I noticed was the lip with the 'frayed' edges, so many from that part of the world have the same type of lip, even some of the Aussie terrestrials.

From: Ron Newstead
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [SPAM]Re: [OrchidTalk] Moss and Cattleya Bowringiana
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 17:00

Jan
I got the impression that Geoff was talking about sphagnum moss, not peat
bogs.

[Snip]
> And yes, peat is a renewable resource, but so is oil and coal, if you
> take the long perspective. The peatbog that industrial exploitation can
> consume in a year has taken at least a couple of thousand years to grow.
> You can go out in the New Forest or wherever and look at a lush peatbog
> and enjoy the beauty of it and you think that is all there is to it, but
> you don't see the devastation caused by industrial production in the
> developing countries. They need the money, and our luxurious lifestyle
> fuels the destruction of their environment − to the detriment of us all.

From: Ron Newstead
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [SPAM]Re: [OrchidTalk] Practicing for the WOC
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 23:45

> Hi Ron,
> So happy to hear you enjoyed the show here in Florida. I have already
> registered for the WOC.

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] dendrobium
Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2007 20:20

An orchid "variety" within the strict meaning of the word is a variation
which commonly occurs , but for some reason (usually not apparent to the
layman) is not considered sufficiently distinct to make a sub-species.
Paph. Insigne var.sanderae is a good example. It is white and yellow
flowered, no spots, or at least only faint pepper dust and not the larger
blotches of the type. The plants are a little bigger too. They were − maybe
stgill are − found growing over quite a large area.

More commonly , the word "variety" is mis-used − especially by growers who
have been in the game for a long time, since 25 or more years ago , the word
was used quite indiscriminately merely to mean "the one I've got" which is
or maybe different from yours, in merely trivial respects. The right word
here is "cultivar" , not variety. Anyone can allot a cultivar name to a
plant in their collection , and it has no significance.

If you can't find "silcocks" − and I've not heard of it too , then the
answer is that it is probably cv not var.
geoff

> Help i have Dendrobium kingianum var silcocks but cannot find info on it,
> its in bloom very perfumed and pure white,can anyone help?

MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE	MONTH	DATE	DATE	DATE	DATE
January	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	February	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-28
March	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	April	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
May	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	June	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30
July	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31	August	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
September	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	October	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31
November	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-30	December	1-7	8-14	15-21	22-31

2007 Archived Messages

22—31 March