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2005 Archived Messages


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MONTHDATEDATEDATEDATEMONTHDATEDATEDATEDATE
January 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31 February 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-28
March 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31 April 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-30
May 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31 June 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-30
July 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31 August 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31
September 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-30 October 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31
November 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-30 December 1-7 8-14 15-21 22-31

June 1-7

From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Rehousing my orchids!
Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 11:25


The light in your greenhouse and more particularly the heat will be FATAL
to your orchids unless you go much further than you seem to think desirable.
They will scorch in no time at all .

Shade cloth cam be bought from most garden centres , cut from the roll,
usually 1.5 m wide. Theoretically it comes in 40%,50% etc values, but I
cannot see much difference. You will need at least two layers on the glass
all over - if you are moving plants from your house during the summer. If
you were to delay until December, you could start with nothing , ands apply
one layer in April and more as and when needed. That would be ideal....
Alternatively you can paint shade ( Summer Cloud is one make) on the inside
of the glass - so that it does not wash off into the rainwater you will
collect.
Bubble pak does not help with shade - it lets 95% of the light through ( if
clean) although it can help reduce temperature especially if applied OUTSIDE
the glass.
Very few orchids will stand full light in a greenhouse in the summer - and
if there are any



To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Onc. identification/culture help please?
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 04:35

I just got a new 'kid. It's an Onc. Mem Ralph Yagi 'Jon', which I understand is an equitant oncidium (or now tolumnia). Can anyone enlighten me on the parentage of this hybrid, and what it's cultural requirements are. I am truly hoping that it is one of the ones that can tolerate cooler temps!
Thanks
Sharon


From: Sharon Williams
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Onc with ginched psbulbs
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 04:55


Hi all: I have an Onc Sphacelatum that has ginched two of it's last psbulbs. It happened first on a new growth this winter, and then l of the 3 new growths now has it. It seems that the very interior leaves on the growths have become pleated within the growth, (not obvious to the eye) preventing them from growing any further. The psbulbs that form are smallish and round. The plant is growing in s/h in gemma stones in my greenhouse (was in good light before being moved into seasonal greenhouse), which has humidity of 30 to 80% during the day. I would have thought that the evap from the stones would help the immediate humidity around the plant, so I am having a hard time believing that humidity is the problem. The plant never gets totally dry, so it shouldn't be lack of water, and has an overflow hole l" from the bottom so don't think it is overwatering. There are 2 other new growths that so far look OK. Any suggestions? Do you think the round psbulbs will push out a spike? (It hasn't flowered for me yet, but I have only had it l year.)
Thanks!
Sharon



From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: shading
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:50

Francis I certainly agree with everything Geoff has said. I have bubble film on the inside and shading and in the summer whitewash also on the outside. My Vandas which like los of light do very well and flower yearly, yet some of the other orchids find the light level too much and show signs of distress. I have two automatic roof vents, a louvred window at the far end and all these together with the door are open on really warm days. Good luck with whatever you decide to do but some kind of adequate shading is a must I would say. Jean


From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Rehousing my orchids!
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 09:10


Thnaks for your advice Geoff,

I see that actually, having a greenhouse is not much
better than growing at home under normal lights, then!

Just a couple more of questions.

You say that bubble pack outside the greenhouse helps
reduce the temperature? Then, if I were to put bubble
pack outside, and two layers of shade cloth inside, on
the south facing area of the greenhouse, leaving the
whole north area free of shade cloth or bubble pack
(to open the vent on that area)... What else could I
do to make sure temps stay down to acceptable levels?

How do you create the right level of humidity inside
the greenhouse making sure that it doesn't scape
through open vents/doors, and still manage to keep the
temperatures down?

This is giving me great headaches. When I look at my
plants, I think that they are suffering, as inside a
one bedroom flat there isn't much I can provide them
with, but I wouldn't want to take them to a greenhouse
that will kill them in weeks either!

Cheers,

Francis.



From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Onc with ginched psbulbs
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 11:00


You can find all the orchid names from several websites . The AOS does one I
think , and certainly the RHS does. Try searching the site under "Research"
"Orchid Names" etc. If stuck ask us, and someone will look it up for you.


Pleated leaves occur in many genera. It is usually a cultural problem,
although a few hybrids have a genetic tendency to do it. They spoil the
appearance of the plant. The harsh advice is cut the growth off, apply
sulphur or something else to the wound to avoid rot ( culinary ground
cinnamon is excellent if you have nothing else ) , and await a good new
growth. No it won't flower for you.


geoff



_____

Sharon Williams wrote:


Hi all: I have an Onc Sphacelatum that has ginched two of it's last psbulbs.
It happened first on a new growth this winter, and then l of the 3 new
growths now has it. It seems that the very interior leaves on the growths
have become pleated within the growth, (not obvious to the eye) preventing
them from growing any further. The psbulbs that form are smallish and round.
The plant is growing in s/h in gemma stones in my greenhouse (was in good
light before being moved into seasonal greenhouse), which has humidity of 30
to 80% during the day. I would have thought that the evap from the stones
would help the immediate humidity around the plant, so I am having a hard
time believing that humidity is the problem. The plant never gets totally
dry, so it shouldn't be lack of water, and has an overflow hole l" from the
bottom so don't think it is overwatering. There are 2 other new growths that
so far look OK. Any suggestions? Do you think the round psbulbs will push
out a spike? (It hasn't flowered for me yet, but I have only had it l year.)

Thanks!
Sharon

_____


From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Rehousing my orchids!
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 11:25


There are three separate problems .( who said growing orchids is easy ?)
1. Keeping temperatures down. The biggest problem is hot glass which
radiates heat into the house. For this, you want something on the outside of
the house. Better still if it is spaced from the glass. Victorians used
wooden laths ( 3cm x 1cm ) spaced 2cm apart , supported on a frame so as to
be 15cm above the glass. This let full light in between the laths, but it
moves over the leaves followed by shade, in a very natural way. It keeps the
glass cool , and you get air circulation between the laths and glass which
helps further in this. You still can't beat it - especially if you are there
to put it in place when the sun comes out, and take it off when the sun goes
in. Those were the days of a man and a boy looking after 600 square feet of
glass, and em0plyed from 8-6 , 6 days a week, for four pence per hour ....
Long gone. But I used this myself years ago , and simply put the laths up
in May and took them down in October.

Bubblepak is of course primarily used to increase insulation against heat
loss , but does work against heat gain ; but not enough on its own, I think
. If you combine with shade cloth, I think you want it on the outside to
prevent the heat reaching the glass . This need not prevent you collecting
rainwater if you are cunning - you have to make sure that it does not cover
the gutters - and can be done , but with a conventional pitched roof
greenhouse you may need to put some laths on the roof, tie them in place
with wire, and then staple your bubblepak and your cloth to those laths. It
will all blow away when we get a winter gale - but you can change it around
for the winter..

Cloth inside the house would not help. Cloth outside is OK. Otherwise, I am
rather stuck for suggestions. Everything I have seen or used other than
shade involves electrics ( Like the giant fans - two four foot dia ones in a
12 foot wide house sucking outside cool air and blowing through large cold
water pads to blow cold fog through the house from one end to the other - as
used in Paris to grow Odonts very successfully)

2. Keeping light down . This is easy , but has only a marginal effect on
heat too . You can use shade cloth , paint the glass, or whatever. Maximum
inside light should be say 20k lux - and outside the light may be 50 k lux
- and if the glass has a transmission factor of 95% you can work out that
something has to be done.

3. Keeping humidity up. It is true that you will get fairly good results if
you have 80% plus at night even if it falls to a much lower figure in the
daytime - and I suggest you work on this . A damping down by a good watering
of the ground from a hose or can after school will go a long way , even if
the door is open all day . And in a wet August , leaving the door open will
give you excellent conditions inside.


geoff.



From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Onc. identification/culture help please?
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 16:30


Sharon Williams wrote:

> I just got a new 'kid. It's an Onc. Mem Ralph Yagi 'Jon', which I
> understand is an equitant oncidium (or now tolumnia). Can anyone
> enlighten me on the parentage of this hybrid, and what it's cultural
> requirements are. I am truly hoping that it is one of the ones that can
> tolerate cooler temps!

It's a hybrid with quite a long family tree, in which Onc. Golden Sunset -
which I have and is fairly red - occurs several times.

Depends what you mean by cooler temps. I grow my equitants/tolumnias with
the phals etc. and they seem to like it. The most important thing is not to
let water stand at the base of the leaves. If you can, water round the edge
of the pot - not so easy if the growths have filled the pot and are hanging
over the edge :-) I have one that was mounted on cork bark but I wouldn't
recommend that as a good way to grow them as the base of the leaves tend to
stay wet when you spray them. One vendor told me to grow them like cacti,
and it seems to work here.

Regards,


From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Rehousing my orchids!
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 18:25


If I may add a comment about humidity. Maybe you would like to try what
I have been doing this spring, and which seems to have worked wonders: I
went to an electronics shop (Maplin in UK) and bought what they called a
'mini-fogger' - it's a little circular thing that uses ultrasound to
turn water into a mist, and they are popular for creating a 'mystical'
effect in small waterfeatures. They come in various sizes - I use a very
small model that costs about £13. The advantage is that they don't
require any special equipment, only a bowl of water and a powersupply -
it will work with tapwater, but the chalk will settle as a fine dust
everywhere after a while, so use rain water. And the mist that is
generated is neither hot nor poisonous.

In my setup I keep the orchids in what is basically transparent plastic
boxes that are open at the top; a layer of water in the bottom keeps a
constant humidity at about 60%, but when the fog is on, it goes up to
90%. The idea came from what I read about cloud forests - forests that
grow in the mountains where the humidity in the air condenses every
morning. After I started on this, my orchids have gone from barely
surviving on my windowsills to thriving, so it must do them some good.

Oh, and I use a very coarse, open 'compost' - basically large chunks of
bark, even for my Cymbidiums.

/jan


From: Ron Bower
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Light Meter.
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 21:10


Please could any member recommend a UK source for a Light Meter, or even a particular meter. Nothing too elaborate, just one able to tell me the number of foot candles. The one I have, sourced from USA requires noontime sun just to make the needle flicker.Ronbow.


From: mhashley
To: Orchid Talk Digest
Subject: Miltonias
Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2005 12:50


Hi James,

Thankyou for all your information about Miltonias.

A very basic question..What causes the leaves to crinkle up ? Is it due to irregular watering, I water them once a week, is this enough ?

Thanks Helen


From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: fogger
Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2005 14:25


That sounds a wonderful idea Jan I would certainly use this method if I hadn't already invested in a humidifier. I'm going to pass on your idea to our local members as it seems such a good way and cheap way of increasing the humidity. Jean


From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Leaf wrinkling,concertina
Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2005 16:50


Hi all, especially Helen,

I am sure that most of us will have seen the annoying leaf pleating/wrinkling/concertina effect, especially on Miltonias and others from the same or close Genus.

What causes it?

Possibly it is because the growing leaf tip gets hung up somehow, and as the lower portion is still growing rapidly away it just begins to crease as there is no escape. Something like a vehicle shunt in the fog.

Erratic watering say some............rubbish say I, "It don't rain at ten to four every Friday afternoon do it"?

It's just one of those irritating things that we orchid growers have to put up with.

It's down to science really. Anything growing upwards is quite happy until its progress is impeded in some way, then it tries to find an answer.

Maybe one day one of us members will notice a leaf which is just showing signs of being caught up, and we then release it, AND WATCH AND TAKE NOTES.

Regards, Rocky.



From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Phytosanitary certificates for orchid flask?
Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2005 18:00


Hi group,

I'm planning to get a flask of seedlings from Malasia,
and the seller says that they cannot be responsible
for shipping to countries where there need to be a
certificate.

Do I need shuch a certificate for getting a flask from
Malasia to the UK? I thought that type of certificate
is not necessary for flasks.

Anyone knows better?

Francis.





From: John W Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Foggers, humidity and Rehousing orchids!
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 07:45


May I dip a toe into the humidity issue?

I tried one or two of the ornamental effect ultrasonic devices, first in a
small conservatory and then later in a greenhouse. Although there was a fine
'fog' generated, it was very localised and although the reservoir needed
frequent topping up (to keep the ultrsonic vibrator submerged) the actual
volume of water consumed was quite low. Compared with a dedicated fogger of
the kind supplied by Simply Controls I believe them to have an
insignificant effect unless confined within a small volume.

To have a dramatic effect in dryish conditions we are talking about several
litres per hour and this would need many of the ultrasonic devices or an
industrial scale set-up of them. When our 'fogger' is in action there is,
literally, a fog that makes visibility from one end of a 16 foot greenhouse
to the other, difficult.

John Stanley




From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Phytosanitary certificates for orchid flask?
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 10:40


Some will tell you that you need CITES and a Phyto . Others will say only
one of these. Yet more will say you need nothing.
No doubt there is a "right" way , but goodness knows what it is.

Personally , making an importation for personal use, of artificially
propagated plants , I would have an absolutely clear conscience, and just go
ahead.

Geoff

francis quesada pallares wrote:

Hi group,

I'm planning to get a flask of seedlings from Malasia,
and the seller says that they cannot be responsible
for shipping to countries where there need to be a
certificate.

Do I need shuch a certificate for getting a flask from
Malasia to the UK? I thought that type of certificate
is not necessary for flasks.



From: len.handley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Light Meter.
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 10:50


Ron,
I grow purely under artificial lights and need a reliable light meter.
Incidentally, they are often called lux meters these days and the lux is the
modern unit of measurement.
I originally bought a light meter from Ratcliffe Orchids but this turned out
to be no good for my purposes because the transducer (detecting element)
actually responded to the infra-red part of the sunlight spectrum rather
than the visual part. This rendered it useless for artificial light with
little or no infra-red element.
I did a search and eventually bought a meter called FX101 from an American
firm called Hisionic International . www.kaitouas.com. I paid by credit card
and it arrived within 3 days. It cost $19.95, plus shipping cost of $24.75
( I think there was a cheaper form of shipping available). This was 2 years
ago. I have been very pleased with it.. It covers three different ranges
from 1 to 50,000 lux and is equally accurate for natural and artificial
light.
There are other American suppliers but some require payment by Money Order
rather than credit card.
Good luck,
Len Handley


From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Foggers, humidity and Rehousing orchids!
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 12:05


John W Stanley wrote:
> May I dip a toe into the humidity issue?
>
> I tried one or two of the ornamental effect ultrasonic devices, first in
> a small conservatory and then later in a greenhouse. Although there was
> a fine 'fog' generated, it was very localised and although the reservoir
> needed frequent topping up (to keep the ultrsonic vibrator submerged)
> the actual volume of water consumed was quite low. Compared with a
> dedicated fogger of the kind supplied by Simply Controls I believe them
> to have an insignificant effect unless confined within a small volume.
>
> To have a dramatic effect in dryish conditions we are talking about
> several litres per hour and this would need many of the ultrasonic
> devices or an industrial scale set-up of them. When our 'fogger' is in
> action there is, literally, a fog that makes visibility from one end of
> a 16 foot greenhouse to the other, difficult.
>

You're absolutely right - the devices I talked about are definitely not
industrial strength, high volume things, and perhaps that is what one
would need for a big greenhouse. However, until I discovered these
little things, all I had to choose between for my very modest setup was
either to put up with half of my plants dying from overheating or drying
out, or invest in hugely expensive equipment targeted at massive plant
factories. To me these little devices are quite adequate.

So that people can compare my setup to their own environment and see
whether it would be feasible for them, here is what I do: I have a built
a number of 'units', each consisting of:

- a 'fogger', no brand name, bought from Maplin, UK, part no. L38AK
- a plastic tray from the garden centre, 1/2 square meter, 10 cm deep
- a metal grid made from chicken wire
- 6 or 7 smallish plastic flower pots
- a sheet of transparent perspex-like plastic bought in B&Q (a DIY shop)
- a 1 liter yoghurt bucket (Onken's Biopot, strawberry flavour)

I used the 'perspex' to erect a 'fence' around the tray (one side comes
off so I can access the plants), filled the tray with about 3 cm of
water, put the plastic pots in, upside down, placed the grid on top of
them (so the orchids are not standing in the water), and finally I
suspended the little bucket above the entire thing, just inside the
'perspex fence', which is about 50 cm tall. The fogger goes inside the
bucket, and you fill water up to just above the word 'Biopot' - it's a
good idea to cut some holes a little above the water line to allow the
fog to ooze out.

I water and feed the orchids once week by taking them all out and
plunging them into a bucket of water, so far I have'nt needed to water
them more. Now I can vaguely imagine that there are some that feel that
yoghurt buckets and DIY perspex don't quite go with the Chippendale
settees and the Louis XVI, but I'm on a budget, and anyway this is only
to give an impression of which size of unit this works with. To scale up
to your size of greenhouse I imagine that you start with roughly 1 of
this type of fogger per 1/2 square meter. Or try out some of the bigger
ones, you can certainly get them a lot bigger than what I bought.

They do use up the water in the bucket - in my setup it takes about 30
minutes. If you are on a less modest budget than I, you might want to
construct something that can automatically top up the water as it is
used, this is not difficult.

What I like about this kind of fogger is that it allows you to start
very small and grow little by little.

/jan



From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Gardeners World BBC 2
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 12:50


Hi all,

Last evening I watched BBC 2, Gardener's World, because they had advertised about planting some terrestrial orchids.

I watched the lady plant them.......thought that the soil/compost when she removed it from the pot was very loose !!!!!

Then I saw Chris Bailes [spelling?] talk about the Early Purple Orchid, and the Twayblade. Now I have to admit that I did not completely hear what he said about the leaf markings, but if he was talking about the Early Purple Orchid........why show the leaf of a Common Spotted Orchid?????

I rest my case.

Rocky.


From: Marina et Jean Michel Dufermon
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Phytosanitary certificates for orchid flask?
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 21:55


Hello all around the world

On 3 Jun 2005 at 19:04, francis quesada pallares wrote:

> Do I need shuch a certificate for getting a flask from
> Malasia to the UK? I thought that type of certificate
> is not necessary for flasks.
On some Thai web site you have lists of countries where a treatment
is necessary to import orchids. A good reason to be on the good paper
of the phytosanitary service of your contry :o)).
I have any information for flask.
I wish you a good weekend.
jmd

--
Yours faithfully,
Jean-Michel Dufermon,
Mangroves help the reef life <


From: James H
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Fwd: Miltonias
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 22:50


accordian leaves are a result of irregular watering, or of root
dammage from too much water, i would check the roots for damage and if
there is none water more often or increase the humidity., i mist the
roots of my milts every day or second day depending on the weather,

mhashley wrote:
>
> Hi James,
>
> Thankyou for all your information about Miltonias.
>
> A very basic question..What causes the leaves to crinkle up ? Is it due to
> irregular
> watering, I water them once a week, is this enough ?



From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: hardy orchids
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 10:05

Rocky, I watched that program too. He was just pointing out that leaves like that indicate that it is an orchid. Unfortunately my mind wandered off just as that lady was explaining the best kind of compost to use! Can you remember what it was? I grow Bletillas very successfully but would like to try another species and would like to know what I should dig in to the compost in our rockery. Jean


From: Jean-Paul Pichardie
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Phytosanitary certificates for orchid flask?
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 11:00


Hello
From my experience it is OK if you use the regular Post Office--not one of
those fancy, overpriced setups who will insist on clearing it up with every
bureaucrat in sight.

I had flasks sent from Australia via DHL (I think). The flasks sat at Paris
airport for about 2 weeks while the various functionaries tried to pressure
me into engaging the services of an official importer (!!!!!). They had NO
idea of regulations governing this type of import and I keep wondering
whether they did not want to take risks or simply wanted to provide revenue
for one of their cronies. In the end I told them to send the parcel back to
Australia. It was then sent back to me via the Australian Post Office at
less cost and without a hitch.

That was 3 years ago so things may have changed.
Yours
Jean-Paul



From: Jean-Paul Pichardie
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meter.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 11:05


Hello Len,
The address is invalid and Hisionic International is un-google-able. Would
you be so kind as to tell us more?
Thanks
Jean-Paul




From: Jean-Paul Pichardie
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meter.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 11:10


Hello Len
I did a Google search for FX101 and this is what I came up with
http://www.multimeterwarehouse.com/FX101.htm
Is this the very same light meter?
Thanks a lot.
Jean-Paul




From: Andy Mckeown
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: coelogyne dayana
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 12:05


I have a couple of big divisions of Coelogyne dayana going spare - both about seven bulbs and growths. If anyone in UK or EU interested contact me off list. They are big plants and the postage will be in the region of £5. £20 incl postage or £15 collect ( N Somerset)

Andy


From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Gardeners World BBC 2
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 13:50


Hi Rocky,

I watched for the same reason, and have to say I was
utterly disappointed!

To begin with, the information about terrestrial
orchids was just insufficient. Then, they did not
bother planting a native orchid at all, and the Dac.
they planted did not even look good. If they were
going to plant a non-native orchid, why not go for
something a bit showier, such as Pleiones, or
Habenaria radiata, or even Epipactis. Or why not try
to get some beautiful native ones as the Lady Sliper
Cypripedium calceolus (spelling?), or the Bee orchid?

Francis.



From: dennis READ
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Phytosanitary certificates for orchid flask?
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 16:20


I have had the same problem. Use the standard post office and you are less
likely to have problems.Regards




From: John W Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 16:30


Hi Folks
Re; light meters and measuring Lux values.
I guess most of us have camera or old Weston meter relegated to the back of
a drawer for things that are too good to throw away but will never be used
again! Many will have cameras which can be manually set (shutter priority)
and have a built-in light meter.
It seems that, if we set the shutter speed to 1/30th second and set the film
speed to ASA/ISO 400, we can read the light reflected of a neutral grey
(gray) card and the camera meter will respond with an appropriate f.stop
value for those circumstances. On a bright UK day that would give an f.32
reading which is about 16000 Lux. How do I know?
I went to
http://www.geocities.com/thombell/charts.html?20055
where there are appropriate conversion charts. Not pin-point accurate but
then, how accurate can we bee in a greenhouse of many coloured plants and
different reflective surfaces. Anyway, for the frugal or poverty stricken or
downright mean, this may be a solution!
John Stanley




From: suzy
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Gardeners World BBC 2
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 17:05


Maybe the bbc were wary of encouraging people to plant native orchids, it
might encourage thieving from the wild, then they would have to go into the
legalities, explain how its an crimal offence etc etc.........




From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Import paperwork.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 17:35


Hi all,

To go along with what Geoff said about the people that should know about permits etc, here is my little story.

Many years ago I was thinking of importing some orchids. So I marched along to an office in Winchester. This office I was told new all about the paperwork required for the importing of orchids.

To be quite truthful I can't remember the exact name of the department, but it was something to do with the Ministry of Agriculture and Fisheries.....I think?

The room that I entered was stacked high from floor to ceiling, and I kid you not, with paperwork, files, folders etc. What a bloody mess!

When I explained to the two people who were in this room what I was after, they just looked at me as is I had just landed from planet Mercury.

I walked out, much the wiser. Knowing for sure what many people had told me about trying to get an import permit.

What a sad state of affairs.

Rocky.


From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Compost for terrestrials.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 17:35

Hi Jean,

Thanks for clearing up the matter of the leaf markings, but what about ALL of the orchids that have no leaf markings???

Compost for the Dactylorchids.......a good cloggy soil. Nice and heavy. Also lighter soils. Take your pick.

If you tell me exactly what terrestrials you have I may be able to suggest what type of compost.

Regards, Rocky.



From: francis quesada pallares
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] hardy orchids
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 17:40


Hi Jean,

Can I ask how do you grow your bletillas?

I tried to move to hardy orchids recently, as I cannot
fit a needle inside the flat, let alone another
orchid! I bought Bletilla striata, Pleione formosana
and Pleione Tongariro. I potted them all in the same
conditions, with a mixture of bark, peat, perlite,
sharp sand and chopped sphagnum moss. so far, Pleoine
Tongariro has done ok, with 2 good growths in one
bulb. Bletillas have only recently started to show
some signs of live (they were all planted together at
the end of April!).

Is that normal for Bletillas, or do you think my
potting medium is not adequate for their requirements?

I'd love to see them shooting and flowering soon.

Francis.



From: Rudolf Günnel
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] conditioning soft cane dendrobiums
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 19:00


Hello Andy,

Supplementary to your experiences with regard to the culture of soft
cane Dendrobiums I read an article in the latest issue of ›Die
Orchidee“. The author, Mr. J. Erftkamp
wrote about the climate conditions in the origin habitat and the
culture of D. nobile, D. wardianum, D. falconeri and relatives.
I attach a copy of a climate diagram (Chiang Mei, Thailand) which is
taken from the same article (It‹s in German but I think you will
understand it without further explanations).
Mr. Erftkamp wrote and I try to quote:
Ŷ›Actually it is enough to reduce the watering in winter time and
lowering the night temperatures about 5 „ 10C, to induce flowering of
the orchids. Some
growers move their plants to cold conditions during the whole resting
time. But when you take a look at the climate diagrams you will notice
temperatures at day
change only little over the year, obviously the decisive factor is the
temperature difference between day and night.“ŶŶ“ At night the
temperatures drop below 10C.
It becomes much drier thus the plant‹s growing season ends. After a
resting time of 2 „ 3 months the buds will emerge.“Ŷ


You were given a good advice by Geoff and your growing conditions are
the right ones.
One note at the end „ I would pour the water out of the pot at the
beginning of the resting time. The combination coolness and wetness is
harmful for a lot of orchids, except cloud forest ones. Enough water
remains within your potting medium so the plants will not suffer.

Best regards from Germany, Rudolf



From: jan
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: Gardeners World BBC 2
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 19:15


francis quesada pallares wrote:
> Hi Rocky,
>
> I watched for the same reason, and have to say I was
> utterly disappointed!
>

I know the feeling. I never watch garden makeovers (or any makeovers for
that matter) any more. There seems to be too much about concrete and the
use of weird metal sculptures; and they seem a bit out of their depth
when it comes to botanical knowledge.

But perhaps we are too harsh in our criticism? What seems like trivial
and basic to us as orchid lovers is probably quite advanced for somebody
who isn't a specialist. It's amazing how fast I can get people's eyes to
glaze over when I tell them about orchids.

/jan


From: len.handley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meter.
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2005 19:45


Hi Jean Paul.
I spelt it wrong, it's Hisonic International Inc.
341 Paseo Sonrisa,
Walnut
CA 91789
USA
I don't think they were the manufacturer, so the other FX101 is probably the
same item.
Len


From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: FW: [OrchidTalk] Light Meter.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 10:15


Those ›self-powered“ ones are real Mickey Mouse. Ratcliffes used to sell
them for about £25 , and the fact that they were cheap is all that could be
said for them.

The one I use is a professional job with three scales ( (X1 , X10 and X100)
and is model MS6610 Luxmeter , notionally covering the range 0-50,000 Lux .
Of course it reads up to 99,999 Lux, but at very bright lights ( above 50k)
the error factor is outside the German DIN on the subject , which I think
calls for less than 10% error.

It is thoroughly satisfactory , and runs off a 9v battery which lasts a long
time with my usage, and has a sensor on a wander lead so that you can hold
it in difficult positions and easily read the display.

It cost me about £70 as I recall it.


I found it by searching the Internet ; I have from time-to-time given
details on the List , and it is just possible that Tricia filed it
somewhere on the website. I suppose I must have an invoice somewhere . But
where ? Perhaps try a search under ›Luxmeter“ to start ?


Geoff




From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] AW: conditioning soft cane dendrobiums
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 10:30

If I could add a note about Chiang Mai ; it is often quoted in relation to
the needful growing conditions for our orchids, and certainly a lot of
orchids we grow were once to be found growing there ( although all the
nearer and choice ones are collected out, I expect).

However , it should be borne in mind that the city of Chiang Mai is located
on the plain , and so is the weather station for the area ( as far as I
know). I believe the plain is about 500m , say 1500 feet above sea level.
But the orchids do not grow on the plain „ apart from the cultivated ones .

The wild orchids come from the hills , which go up to almost 8000feet (
2333 m) above sea level. And some ONLY grow up there.

For example I have found the white flowered Dendrobium infundibulum growing
at the side of the road which ascends the hills to the highest point ,
growing terrestrially or lithophytically „ at any rate growing on the
ground. There is a colony , extending over a distance of maybe 400m) where
the road ascends at an incline ( guessed at , from memory) of 15%

Above the colony and below the colony „ at least over the next mile or so
both ways, the ground appears to be the same ( soil/rock etc) and the other
vegetation,and conditions all seem the same. But no more dendrobiums. Why ?
I assume that the temperature conditions there are exactly right, and a
little higher or a little lower they are not. And these dendrobiums are
maybe a thousand metres above Chiang Mai.

Another example „ if you go pretty well up to the top you can find Coleogyne
nitida „ glorious great plants with dozens upon dozens of growths in flower
( at the right time) - but only on those trees on one side of a copse,
facing a particular direction , and at a particular altitude. And at that
height there was a frost one morning I was there one January. There would
not have been a frost in Chiang Mai town, so much lower down.


The point I want to make is that I wonder whether the reported weather
statistics for Chiang Mai itself are of any value to us as orchid growers ?

And is it not a marvel that we actually get these plants to flower at all,
when they are so fussy about their needs in the wild ?


Geoff




From: Jon Loose
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 11:55


Hmm, Interesting John

The question in my mind is how we get a neutral grey card - can one print
one from somewhere on the internet I wonder or do we have to visit a
photographic specialist?

Jonathon Loose




From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: bletillas
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 12:30


Hi Francis,
Your mix sounds good to me. I have some in pots and others in the rockery where there is normal soil but I dug in a mix of small bark pieces and pearlite and a handful of John Innes seed compost. That was years ago and haven't touched it since. They are protected in winter by a wall at the back and other plants around them. They die back completely in the winter and start shooting up around late March/early April. I think yours sound a bit late and I would have planted them earlier. When buying though many of them don't become available until around January. If I bought them then I would plant them then. I'm not too successful with them in pots as I put tend to forget where I've put them (in the garden somewhere protected) and they get a bit neglected. I've decided to grow them only in the rockery. Good luck with them, it may just be a case of patience. I think they should start growing pretty quickly now. Jean


From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:50


Kodak used to sell an Official Grey card , which was the standard for this
purpose.
Maybe they still do....
I would think that the sort of photographic specialist serving the top end
professionals - not your local Jessops - would stock them.
But then, my local jessops is very helpful - try yours !

Geoff




From: Jean-Paul Pichardie
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meter.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:55


Thank you very much Len.
Yours
Jean-Paul.



From: dennis READ
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Anacamptis laxifolia
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:15


On holiday on Guernsey I saw this orchid growing in profusion in the boggy fields by the coast road. Three years ago I bought a seedling and this is a photo of it.
The individual flower is about 1 inch (2.5 cm) each way . The flower I remember was larger than this.
Does any one Know what size it should be. Regards


From: John W Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -neutral grey
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 18:10


Neutral grey?
Personally I'd guess midway between white and black but you could pick a
shade midway along a comuter grey-scale and print a card but I think we're
really into calibration here and I think we'd be nitpicking to attempt
accuracy that way. A chequerboard of black and white would probably do or a
densely printed piece of text (?) but we are really into repeatability and
ballpark figures aren't we?
All I'm trying to do is provide a source of conversion info for those who
might be au fait with photographic practicalities but are lost when light
reflected needs linking with a light source direct. My point is that many of
us have the instruments for light measurement - incident or reflected - if
we care to calibrate. After all, dedicated devices do tend to cost an arm
anbd a leg, especially if they are stand-alone instruments.
Anyone else care to to put me right? There must be some purists amongst our
gang. Oh; a photo supplier will sell you a piece of grey card . . . . for
money!
Cheers
John



From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: hardy orchids
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 18:35


Hi Rocky, thanks for the reply. I am thinking of buying some Cypripediums. I
have heard that some of them can be a bit trick but as the Bletillas do so
well I thought it worth a try as I find them intriguing. The soil would be
the same as I would put them in the same rockery. At one time the soil was
quite heavy clay but over 30 years we have treated it and dug in compost,
grit, perlite in selected places, some sand and John Innes so it is now
quite a good open well draining soil.
It has some winter protection from a low wall behind and has so many plants
that they tend to shield the orchids from any severe drop in temperature. -
Jean



From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Loss of memory !!!
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 18:50


Hi all,

I have forgotten who sent me the two Paraphalaenopsis.............had a couple of stressful weeks, so can whoever it was please contact me.

I think it was our Jean, but I'm not sure.

Anyhow, the plants came from Norfolk.

Regards, Rocky.


From: Tricia Garner
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 22:50


Geoffrey Hands wrote:
> Kodak used to sell an Official Grey card , which was the standard for this
> purpose.
> Maybe they still do....
> I would think that the sort of photographic specialist serving the top end
> professionals - not your local Jessops - would stock them.
> But then, my local jessops is very helpful - try yours !

Own brand £5.99, Kodak £11.49 from their online shop...


From: John W Stanley
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 23:25


Eleven fortynine!!!! !!.49!!!
My old Weston light meter's probably worth less 'n a fiver!
I think any mid-grey board 'd allow you to calibrate enough for consistency
and comparative readings if you stick with the same stuff.
Maybe you could ask to see a piece and then memorize the shade!
(Y'could buy another orchid for less than 11.49.)
Cheers
John

"Tricia Garner" wrote:

Geoffrey Hands expounded:
> Kodak used to sell an Official Grey card , which was the standard for
> this purpose. Maybe they still do.... I would think that the sort of
> photographic specialist serving the top end professionals - not your
> local Jessops - would stock them. But then, my local jessops is very
> helpful - try yours !

Own brand £5.99, Kodak £11.49 from their online shop...



From: Geoffrey Hands
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] hardy orchids- cypripediums
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 07:50


I decided to buy some for my new garden , and did some searching on the
internet. There was also a very good - in fact excellent article about it in
Orchid Review this/last month.

Frosch in Germany is the man ,i.e. the source of the newer hybrids which
look very good, and Christian Rare Plants is the source in UK.

But you will need to give up your beer for a bit to afford them...

The new price list/offering availability - these are not plants you can
walk in and buy anywhere you know ! - issued at the end of last month. If
you want any , move now !

Geoff

aeranthes wrote:

Hi Rocky, thanks for the reply. I am thinking of buying some Cypripediums. I
have heard that some of them can be a bit trick but as the Bletillas do so
well I thought it worth a try as I find them intriguing. The soil would be
the same as I would put them in the same rockery. At one time the soil was
quite heavy clay but over 30 years we have treated it and dug in compost,
grit, perlite in selected places, some sand and John Innes so it is now
quite a good open well draining soil.
It has some winter protection from a low wall behind and has so many plants
that they tend to shield the orchids from any severe drop in temperature. -
Jean



From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Jersey Orchid.
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 08:40


Good morning Dennis,

And what a smashing morning it is.......about time too.

Dennis, your 'Jersey Orchid', what made you call it 'Anacamptis'? It's 'Orchid laxiflora'. Nearly the same as our Orchis mascula [Early Purple Orchid] but the flowers do not have spots on them and the leaves have no markings, although there may be exceptions of course as there are many very similar orchids in Europe.

I would say that your flower spike looks about normal to me.

There is a good colony growing at 'Kew in the Countryside'...Wakehurst Place.

Most noticeable thing about your orchid is the upward facing spur.

Kind regards, Rocky.


From: Roger Grier
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Cyps.
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 08:45

Hi Jean,

Nice to have heard your lovely Welsh dialect last evening.

Jean, the type of soil best suited for Cyps is.....................................

I have a very good friend who grows many terrestrial orchids and he does it very well, so I will give him a bell, ask him to give me the information and I will then make it known to everyone who wishes to grow these lovely orchids.

Regards, Rocky.


From: Jon Loose
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] hardy orchids
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 10:35


Hi Jean

I have done very well with a hybrid called Gisela - good increase and
flowering. This is in a pot but I reckon it would be very fine outside if
you can keep the beasties away. The north eastern American species are very
hardy indeed - I took some pictures of Cyp. acaule in Massachusetts a few
days ago and temperatures get down to -20C or less. If you stick with the
hybrids to start with they are more vigorous and equally as beautiful.

Good luck with them.

Jon




From: Thomas Hillson
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: [OrchidTalk] Re: Light Meters -ISO ASA and Lux values.
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 14:30


Officially a gray card is 12% gray color and 18% reflective. This is
the official standard, if you do a Google search you will find a lot
of discussion on what it means and what you really need. The 18% gray
card is made by many people and sold in photographic equipment
stores. For accuracy it is what you measure off to get the correct
exposure. Many of the old time photographers like Ansel Adams swore
by the gray card. With out modern camera's with built in light meters
and the latitude of modern film they are no longer needed. It you
want to use a camera's built in light meter to get an approximate
light reading for your plants you can use a gray card. This will give
you a much more accurate reading than if you just went and metered
off your Cattleyas. However since a camera light meter is very
approximate, you are not going to increase your accuracy enough to
make a difference.

I have a nice Extech light meter, I bought to use in my greenhouse,
when I compared it to my camera light meter I found that the Canon
camera measured the light less than the dedicated light meter. In
noon day sun in my greenhouse my light meter gave me 12,400 foot
candles, while the camera off a gray card gave me 8,000 foot candles
and I got the same measuring off my flat of Paph seedlings.

--Tom



From: dennis READ
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] Jersey Orchid.
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 17:35


When enquired about the ''Jersey Orchid'' I was advised by the Hardy Orchid Society it was called Orchis laxiflora. When I tried to buy one from the company that sells them in Dorset, I was informed it was called Anacamptis laxiflora and I bought a seedling ,which has now flowered. In the May/June issue of the Orchid Review it is called Anacamptis (Orchis) laxiflora.
''An orchid by any other name is just as sweet''
Regards




From: aeranthes
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Cyps
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 18:30


Thanks Roger. Any help very gratefully received. Yes it was a lovely surprise to hear from you last evening. My accent is now a hybrid between Welsh and Bristol!lol Jean


From: Ronald Newstead
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Hydroton
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 19:05


This digital photograph shows the material in which I have been planting
many of my orchids, for some time, and they seem to like it.
There is one point on which I am not clear about the instructions that you
can see quite clearly if you enlarge the picture. They say that rainwater
must NOT be used, then go on to say that you fill up the pot with water up
to a certain point - presumably this German company also sells special pots


From: Rudolf Günnel
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Re: [OrchidTalk] RE: conditioning soft cane dendrobiums
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 20:25


Hello Geoff,

Thank you for your response and your informative report about orchid
habitats in the Chiang Mai region.
I did not intend to give the impression that the climate diagram of
Chiang Mai reflects exactly the climate in the orchids' habitats. It
should just be a visual substantiation of the growing rules you gave to
Andy in October 2004.
Every climate diagram is a mix of weather dates, obtained from several
weather stations in the region over a longer period. It reflects only an
average climate in the region. The term "region" is here a wide range,
perhaps 50 - 75 km in diameter, perhaps more or perhaps less?
Of course, you can argue about the benefit of such a climate diagram as
well as that of Chiang Mai, too. But it is a good approximation!
It shows when it becomes drier and colder (Nov.-March) and that night
temperatures drop down to 5C (Dec.-Feb.).
I think that‹s enough to know. In my eyes climate dates should not be
overrated.
You can find climate diagrams in many orchid books regarding the climate
in the habitat of orchids. I doubt whether it is always the exact
climate diagram of the habitat or just the report of the next weather
station in the region.
If you knew exact weather dates of the site where you saw Dendrobium
infundibulum or Ceologyne nitida could you benefit more from that than
from the climate diagram of Chiang Mai? Are you able to simulate
exactly that climate in your greenhouse? I think the answer is no!
I agree to you, it is always a marvel to see how adaptable our orchids
to different growing conditions are. Without that ability to adapt a
successful orchid growing would be impossible.
The same species are growing in greenhouses as well as indoor or in
basements under artificial light „ mounted upon bark as well as potted
with organic or inorganic potting medium or growing in hydroponics - it
is amazing.
The topic is slightly difficult so I hope I found the right words to
express what I mean.

Best regards from Germany, Rudolf.



From: Ron Bower
To: Orchid Talk List
Subject: Light Meters.
Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 21:40


Thank you to those members who have responded to my request. Geoff, you jogged my memory and looking at my records shows that you had a item re meters on list, 17th December 2003 in which you told us that you obtained yours from www.TLC Direct Co. at a cost of £64.16.I have now obtained another meter similar I think to yours, from MEACO price £85.00 + postage about £10.00. Thank you Len, your self powered meter appears to be similar to mine, also from USA, by the name of HYDRO FARM. I paid about £25. and it is very iffy! Infact, now that I have another to check with I find that the self powered one reads less than half the correct value..

This is for Geoff, but any response will be welcome. Geoff I have been looking at and studying your splendid new orchid house. I have a traditional Victorian Conservatory 30ft X 16ft with horticultural 24"X 24" glass roof with plate glass and brick ends and a 16X8 ft green house with tradition clear glass. The conservatory roof needs to be reglazed for various reasons, cracks and a number of leaks it was built in 1970 and the mastic or putty has dried out ect. Am I right Geoff that the roof of your new house is glass and if it is, why did you not glaze it with the modern glass alternatives?
I have before me, a sample of clear twinwall material produced by GEC. Web site. GEStructeredProducts.com ( Case letters as I show.) I think I have seen your comments regarding this type of glazing but I cannot recall if you recommended it or not.I think you were in favour of it but thought it was too expensive.I wonder if my greenhouse, now orchid house would benefit by being reglazed with the same material, less heat loss ect and in your book you seem to favour the modern alternative. Like most things there will be a down side as well as a up and I would welcome yours and any one else's comments and advice.

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